Wargasm

I am getting some CCW rims soon and I'm going to run new tires probably in a 255/40-17 size all around....

My intended use is for 90% very hard street driving (weekend terrorizing of the local roads) and 10% road course driving. No Auto-X. My car puts out just over 400 rwhp, so getting traction in lower gears is very hard or impossible. I don't care about noise or a punishing ride or tread life. I only put about 2000 miles per year on the car at most, so I don't wear out the tires much on the street.

My current tire is a 225/50-16 RA-01. These seem OK in the summer especially given the skinny size, but when the asphalt gets cold in the winters, I can make the car fishtail on a roll-on from about 80 mph. Forget about going WOT unless you are in at least 3rd or 4th. This is scary! I think the main problem is that these tires are old and have been heat cycled many times over 3 years of mostly street driving.

I am having a REALLY hard time making up my mind between these:

Pilot Sport Cup
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A race tire... only problem is that I am not sure if you can really keep them heated up (or close to it) on the street... according to their documentation:
The tread compound’s most effective temperatures are in the 160 - 220°F range. I don't mind a tire that needs a small warm up like my RA-01 does, but I don't want a tire that is like driving on 4 pats of butter unless you really wail on them for several turns in a row to get them warm. This isn't really safe or fun on the street. I need something that can heat up a decent amount with just a few warm up "squiggles" on the road (I got pulled over doing this once hahh)

Pilot Sport PS2
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Street tire. I'm worried it will not hold the power of my car well on full throttle.

PZero Corsa
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Race tire... The only reason I found these is that I can get a good deal on these, but I don't know much more about them. Are these any good for what I want to do? What I -really- don't want is an outdated or crappy R compound. So you end up with all the downsides of R compound + not really that great of a tire anyhow! So are these "up there" with the RA-01, Sport Cups, etc?

Advice is very welcome!

Thanks,
Brian

gnx7

iTrader: (10)

If you are going to plunk down the cash for CCW's and $300/tire Pilot Sports you should get some 18x10's and run 285/30/18's all the way around. The size is overkill for the street.... but you can just run your stock rims/tires... then run some uber sticky DOT tires on the CCW's when duty calls (track/backroads).

Pilot Sports are supposed to be very very sticky but wear fast. RA-1's have a reputation as long wearing and once up to temp provide great traction as well.

-GNX7

maxcooper

The taller sidewalls on the 17s might actually help even more than the wider width of the 18s for traction under acceleration.

Another tire to consider is the Nitto 555 RII. They are very sticky. I'm not a huge fan of Nitto generally, but I drove a Z06 with these tires and I was quite impressed with the grip. They are streetable R-compounds, much like the RA1.

-Max

owen is fat

I'm surprised you arent looking into running at least 275 wide tires all around, especially with that type of traction issue. then if youre gonna buy CCW's I'm shocked... why not run those pettit flares out back allowing like 315's in the rear and run 285's up front. there are guys running that type of setup and its phenominal for grip with big hp... and totally streetable. you can stay 7" and stilll run those widths too.

also the Kumho MX is one hell of a street tire... be sure to look into it !

DamonB

Whatever you do don't by any sort of race tire for street use. They'll harden and turn into bricks quickly.

David88vert

I've tried many tire combos. The best solution that I have found for a street tire, that can handle track days well - in either hot or cold weather - has been the Bridgestone S-03 Pole Position. Equal grip in wet or dry. That's my recommendation. Reasonabvle price for the performance.

Wargasm

Here's the thing on the tire width. I refuse to run fatter tires in the rear, so I'm pretty much limited by what I can run up front. I also don't want to roll my fenders and I want to have enough clearance with a 25 1/4 inch ride height to avoid ripping up my pristine fenders.

So that's how I came up with 255/40. Maybe I'll do a 275, but I dunno.

Carl Byck

You should really look at 285-30-18 all around. I know 275-40-17 will fit all the way, but since a 285-30 is shorter, with the correct offset, they may fit. As far as tires, the BFG KD is the best bar none in the dry. The MX is nearly as good, and is safe in the wet (unlike the KD). I run 285-40-17/255-40-17 on my Supra w/~400ftlb of torque, and unless I dump it, the rear never breaks loose. I have run RA1, V700, KD, MX, AVS Sport, and others. The V700 cannot handle the heat cycles on the street. The RA1 is great if you ony drive in the summer(suck in the cold on the street), the KD is great dry but dangerous when wet, The MX wins the all around, better than an R compound cold, safe in the wet, and only ~1 sec off a KD w/a pro driver on a 1 minute AX course. Damon saw over 1 G on MXs on his plotter with very few suspension mods. So, stop refusing to run fatter tires in the rear, or slide around all day, your choice. A 255-40-17 R compound will spin all day below ~150 tread temp. If you go wide in the rear, the rears last about half as long as the fronts, so you simply buy two rears for every one front. What's the big deal. Seriously, why do you
"refuse" to run wider tires in the rear? Every high HP car in the world runs larger rears, unless it has been modded to accept huge fronts. the downside of 275-40-17 all around is their height. See if CCW says you can fit a 285-30-18 up front, or go to a larger rear. Regards, Carl

Broken09

iTrader: (1)

I'm running 265/35/18 BFG KD's on my car and traction is no issue what so ever whether in the straight line or in the curves. I haven't gotten onto a road coarse yet with my setup but I was putting down right around 410-415 before I put it up for the winter.

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

Brian,
You need a wider rear, no point in refusing. What is your problem w/ a wider rear? 255/40 just isn't enough for your car... heck it isn't enough for MY car.

You could do the 285/30/18 all around... If you absolutely have to have the same size all around, it's probably the best bet because the front tire diameter will be small.

The extra sidewall of a 275/40 might do you some good in the rear in alot of ways, but running one up front on the street might be a pain... guys do it on the track, but it has clearance issues.

The other wrinkle in all of this is that I don't think you have coilovers (meaning 2.5" springs), so i'm not sure you can run a 10" +50 wheel up front to get the big tire in there... But CCW will know.

In any case, I might recomment the BFG KD (not the KDW)... it's supposed to be the "nearest to R compound" street tire, and is available in 255/40/17, 275/40/17, 265/35/18, and 285/30/18. I'd have them on my car if they had come in the sizes I wanted.

If I were you, i'd run the 255/40 front, and 275/40/ rear... or the 285 all around if the 10" +50 will fit.

DamonB

Yep. And I pulled over .9 G in the rain! on the MX's as well! Numbers from that run on the right. The one on the left was on worn Victoracers in the rain.

potatochobit

iTrader: (1)

i have 255/40/17 on my rear, but i am using Seq TT. if you are pushing 400 rwhp on your t04s, i'd say you'd be more happy with a little wider in back. seems to me that you are more interested in drag racing then cornering performance? if you dont need to worry about understeer, go wider than 255 in the rear since you have a single.

i cant begin to imagine how bad your wheel hop might be with 225s in the back and 400hp, lolz

Wargasm

The reason I don't want to run wider in the rear is because I did that on my 87 Turbo II and I went from perfectly balanced to a deathtrap handling-wise. It would push at first and then suddenly snap around. I upgraded to 225/50 on the front to match my rears and it was perfect again. So I'm really leary of wider rears.

Before spending a lot of money on wider rears, I'd like to see how another car drove with the exact size/offset/setup.

I prefer handling over drag-launch-ability, so that's why I thought I could get away with 255 all around.

Wargasm

OK it's down to

18x10 with 285/30
or
17x9.5 with 255/40

Will the 18x10 setup rub my front fender lip? (my car is lowered).

rynberg

Wargasm, the FD does not handle like that with wider rear tires. I run 235/265 and many others run similar setups. My setup WILL push at the track in tight hairpins a little bit but it never PLOWS. Also, to me, the wider rears make the rear-end breakaway more predictable, not suddenly letting go. I'm with Ptrhahn, run 255/40 and 275/40 17.

gfelber

Agree. Mazda used 17x8 on 235 rubber up front and 17x8.5 on 255s rear for the SP1, Spirit R, etc cars to (obviously) good effect. Know a few folks who road race on 285-30-18 front and 305-30-18 rear and I believe the SM2 auto-X guys are using 315s and 335s out back with 285 fronts.

If you have to go with 17s then run 255 front and 275 rear. Otherwise go with the 285 all around on an 18" wheel. I have no clearance issues with the latter on CCWs, but will check the ride height for you if you like. My car is lowered a bit.

Gene

Wargasm

285/30 18 seems great with 18x10.... if it fits. It would be great if you could check your front wheel fender lip height for me. Mine is 25 1/4 inch.

Broken09

iTrader: (1)

I was advised by a number of people to run at 25 1/4 with either the 285/30/18 or 265/35/18 combinations. That's where I'm set at now and I have about 2 finger widths between the tire and the fender. I've had no rubbing issues to speak of.
-Nic

Wargasm

Do you have 285/30 18 at all four corners? You have 2 fingers laterally or vertically?

Here's my finger measurement kinda diagonally.... this is with 25 1/4 ride height and 225/50-16 Toyo RA-01.

Brian

ptrhahn

iTrader: (9)

When did you get married??

Youy might be close running that low w/ 285. CrispyRX7 (locally) has 285 fronts on 18x10" wheels for his street setup, and 275/40/17's on 17x10.5's for his track setup. I think he decided to raise his car a bit for safety as a result. Check out his website for pics.

Skeltah

Hey Brian,

I'm running Peter/Patfat's old setup(255x17f & 275x17r) on my car and I love it.. My car doesnt have anywhere near the hp that your car has, but it should be very similar in the twisties(Koni yellows and TEIN sTECH springs).

Broken09

iTrader: (1)

Brian,
I'm sorry my post wasn't clear. I'm running the 265/35/18's. For street use and aesthetics I went with the slightly taller tirewall to fill the fender more. I've had no rubbing issues to speak of with this combination. I have 2 fingers vertically from the top of the tire to the bottom of the fender lip. I will be buying another set of the 18x10's for track use and putting 285/30's on them. Should be in the next month or two, so I'll post at that time after I've run them in an event.
-Nic