HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE=DigitalSynthesis] Here's what I've learned:

Per RETed:

17" x 8" +27mm offset (+30 to +25 should work) with 225/45/17 up front
17" x 9" +20mm offset (+15 to +30 will work) with 255/40/17 in back

[QUOTE]

Ok, I have read ~ the first 15 pages, and I think I'm down to 2 questions.
I'm looking at tire sizes before wheel sizes to get an idea of what I'll be running on my '88 TII so I can get the proper width wheel to match the tires. This will be a Road Race/Hill Climb car with quite a bit of HP that I would like to hook to the ground. I understand RETed's statement regarding the inclination to push when you've got a front tire that is too different from the rear tire, and I'm hoping to prevent that. BTW, it looks like I'll be running JIC FLT A2's for the suspension if that makes any difference.

I'm looking at the Kumho 710's, with the following specs per Tire Rack's website.
225/50 WR16
Rim width range 6-8"
Measured rim width 7"
Sect. width 9.1"
Tread width 9"


265/45 WR16
Rim width range 8.5-10"
Measured rim width 10"
Sect. width 11.2"

With this being the case, I'm looking at a 16x8 with a +25-30 offset in the front, and a 16x9 with a +20-30 offset in the rear, closer to 25 if I can get it to make sure I have good clearance inside the fender. Has anyone had any experience with either of these sizes or have any input as to going one way or another with the offset for safe clearancing? Also, any good leads on where to find some wheels in these sizes that won't break the bank or weigh a ton?
Thanks in advance.

Black91n/a

For a race car I'd run 245/45/16's in front, it'll give more grip and can be made to fit, especially with coilovers, as they'll give a little more room. It'll help minimize the effects of the stagger too (understeer).

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the quick reply. That's what I'd like to do, but Kumho doesn't have a 245/45/16 I could do that with the Hoosiers, but I'm looking at more $$ as well. I could do a 245/45/17 front & a 275/40/17 rear in the Kumhos, that also gives me the option of the Victoracers as a rain tire. Should I stick with the 8" fronts or go to a 9" since I'm adding almost an inch of tire width? Have you had experience with these sizes? Thanks.

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Ok, I'm about cross-eyed from reading more of this monster thread, but here's one more post to add to it

Looking back @ arkady151's post about Mustang wheels, I see 17x10.5 on the rear w/~+15 (+20max) offset, should work with the 275/40/17 tire as a general agreement. For the front, a 17x9 wheel with ~+15 could work with the 245/45/17. I'm not scared to roll the fenders for extra room if necessary, but I do want to make sure I've got clearance after I roll the fenders w/o having the coilovers all the way up

I understand RETed's standing on tire size = wheel size, but the specs on the 245 mention an 8" measured rim width and the 275 = 10.5" measured rim width. Would this mean that an 8" rim is preferred for the 245 over a 9" rim? Knowing that 25.4 = 1", it's easy enough to see that 9" is pretty much on the money outside of a 9.5", so I just want confirmation from someone that's been there before. This is my first 7, and I don't want to be cussing it if I can be grinning from ear to ear going around the race track instead. Thanks again for ya'll's help.

Black91n/a

A 245/40/17 is the proper diameter and will give you less trouble with rubbing because it's shorter, but there's no 710 in that size. I'd think you'd need to get pretty aggressive with the fender rolling to get those on there. I don't thik there's an inch of extra space between my tires and fenders (15mm less offset, plus 10mm more tire on each side = 25mm = ~1")

I prefer to mount a tire on a wheel that's to the upper end of the manufacterer's reccomended widths, because it'll put more rubber on the road and give better feel and feedback, but I don't like the super stretch thing that the drifters love. I'd get a 17x9 for 245/40/17's.

Will this be your first experiance on race tires? If so maybe the 710 isn't the best choice, as it's, well, fragile. Either of the V700's would make a better starting point, or the Toyo RA-1, Yokohama A-032R or the Nitto NT-01 would be better still, as they're long wearing and resistant to abuse. Don't think that you "need" the best tires, in amateur racing there's LOTS of people running RA-1's and such when they can run Hoosiers and even full slicks, because they last all season, so they can actually afford tires that way.

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Ok, so if I'm reading you right, you're running a 225 on an 8" rim, right? I'm struggling with the offset from your comment, but if I'm calculating/understanding correctly, the 9" with the 15mm offset has a back space of 4", so you're at a 25mm backspace with your 8" wheel to get an inch of room between the fender & the tire, and you've got good clearance on the backside, between suspension & tire?

I'm the same way on wheels, that's how one of my mentors taught me to do it, but I've also fooled with cantilevers before which can throw you sometimes. One thing I've learned is to do research, it's cheaper than trial & error

I've been racing for several years, former SEDIV champ in TT in my 325is, haven't got to play as much in the last car, S/C Miata with 175 rwhp, but I've had a good bit of experience with different tires. I like the V700's & the V710's, love the grip & feedback of the 710 better than the old AS303. Also the price is better than the Hoosiers I'm relatively easy on tires, usually I can get an entire season out of them or better, don't know how the story will be with the added hp/torque I'll have with this beast, but that's why I'm looking for a bigger contact patch in the rear, to get the power down. For starters after I get this built I will most likely do some playing on some Azenis or Ecstas to get a feel for the car before I go to the really sticky stuff, but I want to be prepared for when I do go to the sticky. Same mentor told me to learn on good tires, you're learn more about where you're screwing up & how to drive better than you will on great tires, because they'll make up some of your screw-ups, and the easiest place to get more speed out of a car is behind the wheel.

RETed

I think your original 225 / 265 combo is too big of a stagger.
If the car was at relatively stock power levels, the 265's are just too much tire in the rear.
I currently run Bridgestone S-03's, which are some of the top street tires you can buy, in 225 / 50 / 16 size, and I can get the car to rotate rather nicely.
I can't imagine running such a wide tire as 265's in back to get the car to rotate at all.
I don't have any direct experience with the Kumho's, but I have run Toyo RA-1's in all 225 / 50 / 16 size with similar results as my S-03's.

I would recommend dropping the stagger difference front versus rear...
What are the available sizes from Kumho?
Would stepping up to 17" diameter give you better choices?


-Ted

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Ted,
Thanks for the reply. It will be nowhere near stock power levels. I'm bastardizing the car with a 5.0/5 speed combo that's been stroked to a 331 with AFR185 heads, I'll be looking at ~350+ at the rear wheels. Going to 17" puts me with a 245/275 stagger, which I like a little better, but race rubber size selection leaves a little to be desired. I could possibly go with 245 front & rear, just not sure that's enough tire in the back for me. My other thought was 17" front & 16" back on the diameter to go with the 245 in front & 265 in back, more of a stagger to my liking. I may end up having to go with Hoosier or Avon to get a better stagger, but I was hoping to avoid the $$$ of Hoosier, and I'm not familiar with Avon. I'm an old fart that likes sticking with what he knows until someone logically explains a better way
What are your thoughts on the 9" front tire with a 245/45/17? I'll be running the JIC FLT A2's for suspension, so I've got a little more room to play with. 17x9 with ~+15mm offset & 245/45/17 on the front. It looks like the 17x10.5 with ~+15 offset would work in the back with a 275/40/17 if I'm reading the rest of the thread correctly.
There will not be any real "street" rubber fitted to this car out side of some Azenis or Ecsta's to play with & get a feel for the car when it's finished before I got to the sticky stuff. Thanks for your help.

RETed

Yeah, with that kinda torque, you'd need the 275's out back!
With the 275's back there, I like a 255 / 40 / 17 size up front to keep the stagger down.
Kumho doesn't make such a size?
This is actually a pretty popular size.

If all else fails, why not try and stuff another set of 275's up front?


-Ted

Black91n/a

I've got 225's on 8" wheels, 30mm offset, and there's not much room to spare under stock fenders. Coilovers give a little more room on the inside, but there's a limit to how much you can roll/pull the fenders. I know it's tempting to go for huge meats under the car, but just keep in mind that they might not fit without a bunch of work.

FC3S_nataku

iTrader: (3)

hey everyone. im about to get some rims and after reading the thread i think im going to get some zigens. the size im getting is +35 for 8" FRONT wide +35 for 9" REAR. is this going to rub? im getting some coilover is a month or two if that changes anything. thanks

Gabe

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

So you see my dilemma with getting the power down. I wouldn't mind the 255's up front, but finding the sizes I need is the hardest part. I really don't think I could squeeze the 275's up front without a body kit. I don't mind rolling the fenders, but I really don't want to get into a bunch of work to make the tires fit, I'd rather find something off the shelf that works with some mild adjustments to the car, nothing super radical. I'm going to attach the links below for the Kumho 710's, 700's, and the Hoosier A6, see what sizes ya'll think I can put together that can let me put the power to the road without a bunch of oversteer & rubbing. Thanks again for ya'll's help.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec.j...e1=yes&place=2

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec.j...e1=yes&place=4

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Spec.j...e1=yes&place=0

RETed

There's a lot of shops making front FC overfenders that would easily solve this problem.
No worries of fender rolling, and the overfenders bolt right in.
Maybe this could be an option for you?
I think your car could use 275's in all 4 corners.


-Ted

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Would it look odd with the front overfenders & not flaring the rears? Where can I find these overfenders? Thanks for your help.

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

What do ya'll think about these?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/86-87...QQcmdZViewItem

RETed

Keep the fronts mild, and it should be fine.
20mm or even out to 30mm should be okay.
Don't try and go 50mm up front with no rears!
50mm = 2"!

Yah, those should be fine.
I would think it would help you get those 275's under the fenders!
Good luck!


-Ted

Lam_Clan

17x8+45 & 17x9+38 would these fit a TII without rubbing? Running Bilstein coilovers.

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

That's why I was asking, didn't realize that there were different size fenders out there, I was afraid they would all be like the 50mm size that I've seen before, didn't want to look goofy & over riced. I like the more subtle 20mm, even if I have to go with 265 instead of 275, I'll feel a lot better than with 225s for sure! Thanks for all of your help & patience guys, I know I'll be back for more help later on.

unicorn_squad

no. +45 is WAY too high for a 8.
the 17x9's would fit in the rear.... as long as you didn't plan on running a huge tire on it.... like no bigger than 255.

RETed

Answered in your other thread you started...

8.0", +45 is too much up front.

9.0", +38 no problem in back.
In fact, I was looking at a customer's car this past weekend, and it looks like the FC can go 9.0", +45 in back...


-Ted

RETed

No problem.
Keep us informed!
I'd like to see if everything worked out for you!


-Ted

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

Will do. I'll be back around for more input, like camber/toe, etc. Better to go with an acknowledged good starting point than trying to find everything trial & error.

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

oops, jumped the gun a little. 275/40/17 @ all four corners = 17x10.5 +0 Front & 17x10.5+15 rear? or should I look at a 17x10 + 0 in the front?

RETed

17" x 10.5, +0 or 17" x 10.0, +0 will work up front.
I dunno what the ideal wheel width is for those tires?
Check with Kumho?


-Ted

HoserRacing

iTrader: (1)

10.5 is ideal, but don't know how hard it will be to find. I don't feel that a 10 is enough of a difference to effect me and may be easier to find. If it does make that big of a difference, I may drop back to the 265/45/16 & do that in a 10" wheel.