RETed

That is true.

Yes, we got two of them.
One 3" one and one 4" one...
I have a personal beef with Spearco and now Turbonetics.
I don't have a personal beef with HKS, and I feel HKS products are quality (I did not say they all were worth the price.


Funny, if it were so easy, why does Turbonetics have such a hard time trying to get it right...


This is the difference between you and I.
If I believe a product is worth the extra money, I work a little more for it.
I paid $400+ for a Tial 46mm WG.
I paid $1,400 for a Tial 55mm(?) WG.
I would pay $700+ for an HKS Race WG, no problem.
I currently work two full time jobs just to dump money into the car.
I feel it's worth it.
I abhor knock-off companies.
I was saddened to find out SSR Japan went backrupt.
I was more furious when SSR Japan "unofficially" cited cheap, knock-off wheel companies (mostly SE Asia) were undercutting their profits; SSR used to make some of the most original wheels designs in the world.

The discussion is going in circles now.
I'm don't see further participation in this thread of any use at anyone at this point.

Enjoy your car!


-Ted

MARTIN

I have the smallest wastegate size. I should run something a lil bigger. And the settings on the MT are not a bandaid solution, it is a precaution. I would use the same precaution whether im running the SS WG or a $1k WG.

Bukwild

"But then again whose to say it wont happen on an HKS or "brand" name either. It would be nice for someone to try one out and actually see if and how long it works for."


Yeah I think Carl and myself are the only 2 that have this SSAC 50mm so we can be the test fail over. I am waiting for my turbo to get here so Carl will probably have his up and running before mine is even installed and tuned

Carl Byck

O'k, I have the WG, I will take everyone through this step by step. Understand going in, that I expect there to be challenges, but in the end run, I believe I will have a WG for 200.00 that performs as well as the 650 HKS piece.
Here is what recieved for 202.50 delivered;
- the product arrived in 10 days from end of auction, it was well packaged, and contained the following,
- 50mm WG w/ beveled mounting flange and proper metal gasket(all gaskets, valve, DT, and bolts are stainless)
- dump tube(12") w/cleanly tig'd flange polished
- extra dump tube flange(to make the DT off the exhaust), and metal gasket
- bolts to attach wg/dump tube
- bolts/nuts for WG/mani
- triple layer DT/exhaust gasket
- 6 springs, all appear to be over 15 psi springs, except for the installed spring, which looks to be ~8 psi spring, so basicly the extra 5 are not useful other than very high HP applications
Observations;
- machining, and castings are identical to HKS gate in terms of fit finish, and overall quality as far as visually.
- constrution seems to be the same
- there is not a screw for the top pre--tensioning bolt ( I think almost nobody really uses, or understands its use, and adjustment in practice. a 10mm bolt seals the hole fine.
- diaphragm seems to be of same material, and overall thickness as HKS, mine is fabric impregnated with silicone from what I can tell.
- flange bolt holes are all perfect with regard to alignment both dump, and
- all in all very complete, only complaint so far would be 5 useless springs, they sell other rates for 10.00 each, I would not trust their stated rates, and I would buy all three optional rates to experiment with. They are ~4psi/7psi/15 psi supposedly
- vacume fittings wit perfectly

O'k, ready to go, first probem, the bolts on the WG (grade 12.9 hardened metric allen bolts) start to thread into manifold, but then are hard to continue to thread in. I check thread pitch, and size, all seems in order. on closer examination, I think the thread pitch is slightly off. You can thread the bolts in, but it requires more effort than it should I check the bolts with a nut, and they are perfect, yet they are tough to thread into the mani. Once a bolt has been run in once it is inserted, and removed with ease. Due to the lack of accessability of two of the bolts I will use a die to see if it is the manifold, or the bolts. It is an easy fix, but would certainly stall your project. It is note worthy that these bolts work perfectly with other nuts, just not the manifold. I'm going fishing with my boys, so that's all for now until I adjust the thread pitch issue. Carl

sub-zero

Carl I will buy a couple high pressure springs from you?

Steve

sleeperfc

keep us updated with how it goes once you get it installed and go boosting.

odds are im going to go with this one too.

the 50mm ones i see that have the extra springs dont come with the dump tube?

umm maybe im not seeing all the ones i see have the springs and hardware but no tube.

link me to one if you got a sec so i can see the one you actually got.

MARTIN

Sounds about right, everything came in order. I dunno how you are mounting the wastegate(in/off the car). It is much simpler with the manifold off, that way you can assemble everything and drop it in together. I never had a problem with the thread.

Jack

iTrader: (2)

I have owned and run the 50MM ebay HKS style for a year. So far no problems, which includes 3 track days at Lime Rock. I had a disk machined and installed so now spring tension is adjustable via the scew on top.

Carl Byck

Thats fine, I cannot tell you exactly what psi they are, but they are the same physical size as the HKS springs I'll give you a couple once my set-up is dialed in, just pay me shipping.
As for the dump tube, and the extra hardware, it is not shown, but has arrived with the last three me and my buddies bought that come with all the springs. not sure what the deal is on the threads, could be some hardened antiseize in the manifold threads. Carl

BlaCkPlaGUE

I think if HKS showed us their budget plan for the HKS wastegates in exact detail, we'd all just shut the hell up

*edit
I mean exact costs of the R&D, materials, advertising, etc. .

Carl Byck

Anyway, for those of us not afraid to bankrupt poor HKS, I shortened the bolts, hit them with some PB Blaster, ran them in, and out a couple times sans WG with an impact, and bolted the WG up. Fits fine with my 3.5" DP, a 4" DP would be tight, and a 4.5" or larger would require a different WG, or a larger angle on the DP(mine is ~130*).
The dump provided is too short, and at the wrong angle to interface with the DP. However, a 90 EMT sweep from the local hardware store will work nicely with the extra weld on flange provided.
The WG performed as advertised, holding .65 bar from 3400rpm to redline with the EBC off. With my AVCR on set at 1 bar, and 50% duty cycle, the WG worked perfectly, building 1 bar by ~4000rpm, and holding it til redline. Remember, this car is not tuned, so ignore the RPM numbers. The valve is a heavy stainless valve, far more substantial than the HKS standard it replaced, There is a SS valve guide pressed into the casting, and retained with a hardened C clip. After dis-assembling and re-assembling the valve, I can see how the one documented failure likely occured; when re-assembling, care must be taken to avoid damaging the diaphragm on the edge of the spring cup.
I was pleased to see that the springs from my HKS standard will work perfectly in this WG, and the spring supplied is slightly softer than the 1 bar HKS spring, just as itshould be. That is all for now, Brian Cain will be tuning the car Friday, stay tuned Carl

mightypns

Hey mate, i got this off another forum. these are for the springs on ebay from ssautochrome. The spring should be differant colours.
White = 4.5 psi
Silver = 6 psi
Yellow = 7 psi
Brown = 9 psi

MARTIN

thats incorrect. The springs on ss autochrome come higher than 1 bar. I smallest one is the one that comes in the WG which is 10psi

1.1 BAR Spring -- BLACK SPRING
1.2 BAR Spring -- WHITE SPRING
1.3 BAR Spring -- SILVER SPRING
1.5 BAR Spring -- YELLOW SPRING
1.6 BAR Spring -- BROWN SPRING

Carl Byck

I have only run the one that came in the WG so far, it was .65 bar on my cast manifold, the other springs are definitely heavier. Martin, where did you get your info? I will be running as much as 2 bar, so I will be able to test some of the other springs. For this go around, I hope to be able to tune to 25psi, I will do that on a 1 bar HKS spring most likely. the spring in the WG is not powder coated like the ones that come with the WG, it is bare metal with some yellow paint. SSAC uis selling other springs, but they do not say what WG they are for, so it would be a crap shoot. My buddy shotened the standard spring, and was able to hold .8 bar on a GT42R on a MKIV Supra. The reason for the higher boost is a poorly designed (SSAC) manifold. He hogged out the WG inlet into the manifold, and eliminated his boost creep problem. He also cut 1 360* coil from the spring. I would not recomend that, as my understanding is that, that should increase, not decrease the spring rate. I think he would have hit the .65 bar number if he fixed the manifold, and left the spring alone.

MARTIN

Exactly. If you cut a loop from the spring, you just made it hold less boost. I got the info directly from ssac site. The spring in my WG holds 10psi perfectly

Bukwild

my turbo is still not here......i am crying why typing this. When I get it I will post my findings. I am going to buy a few hks springs for saftey because if this fails it would seem that it would be the springs fault. Plus they are not to expensive anyways. Good luck guys and post the numbers once BDC tunes that bitch

MARTIN

there is no reason for the spring to fail. IF anything, the heat will cause the springs to get softer and therefore open the WG sooner.

Carl Byck

The only failure other than a diaphragm, would be if the tolerances were not right on the valve guide. In that scenario, if you had two materials with different coefficients of expension, and that was not accounted for, then the valve could seize in the guide. Luckily HKS studied that, and SSAC copied it, so should be NP. Carl

MARTIN

I have run the WG as hot as anyone can run it, and it has not seized. So thermal expansion is nothing to worry about.

vspecpgt

which company should we be buying it from?

is "XS power dot com" the same as "stone mountain racing" which is also the same as "SSAutrochrome"

prices on these are going up.

i don't care about the xtra springs, and the dump tube wouldn't fit on my car anyway, as i need it to be a 90 degree angle. as long as it comes with the wastegate to manny flange and the dump tube flange.

so, any place i shouldn't buy from?

Carl Byck

Stone mountain, and SSAC are the same, the dump is a 90*. I just fitted a 1 bar HKS spring in mine, as I am tuning at 20, and 25 psi tomorrow, and the .65 bar spring it came with seemed unlikely to hold that boost even with the EBC. Carl

RETed

Welp, you guys got your wish.
I just found out HKS just slashed most of their prices on their wastegates...
Go figure...


-Ted

andre sinclair

iTrader: (36)

Just bought a HKS SS Racing Wastegate from SPOOLIN7

PAID half for it, the actual cost of the Hks price...I couldn`t deal with all the Drama.

Thanks again,

Andre

kabooski

really? by how much %

RETed

From the numbers I've seen, it's around 30% or more.
The GT series WG are not affected, but the standard and race WG's prices are all cut.


-Ted