Are you going to have them load the dyno and move to an RPM format with the next runs?

 

the rest stop just north of the commercial road toal on the turnpike sells E85. it is just south of the atlantic exit. if you are going to see jack, it is a god half way point for you. anyways, i really like the way the engine bay looks with that setup, nice and clean!

 

+1

....sounds good James!...see you friday!...

-Jack

 

darkphantom dont worry mate.

If you have a 700rwhp car. You will know it. They are bloody unreal to drive and the power is something very hard to describe especially in a light car.

You must have really good tyres to get that thing to hold down traction.
Mine wont hold down even at 200 km/h(its good on slicks traction is good but on street tyres is ****).

 

/\ im running on Nitto 555r and im still spinning in second. first doesn't exist anymore lol

thanks for the comment simon

 

I don't see why people are getting upset by this, a number is just that, a number. It doesn't affect anyone else, and even if the dyno is off for whatever reason, or it isn't, it doesn't take away from anyone else's accomplishments. I'm sure all the haters (-see definition: A person that simply cannot be happy for another person's success. So rather than be happy they make a point of exposing a flaw in that person. ) on here aren't rocking setups anywhere near phantom's...

 

this ill be very interested in hearing about so we can close this book on what power it actually is.

also enzos brother hit 143mph with 620whp so as long as your above that figure you will be fine

 

Well for starters, you're not exactly sure what we are rocking are ya?
Not all of us enjoy posting build threads.. so I dont think it's right for you to group up together with those who do fit your description.

I'm agreeing with those who are suggesting that the specific turbo on his car doesn't flow enough to support his h/p claim. Now I'm also looking at other things in his car that are either cheaper quality parts (ie: obx wastegate) and the poorly designed square end-tank intercooler and whatnot and attempting to add up how he's managing to squeeze every single last drop of power out of that turbo when other pieces seemingly are lacking in efficiency & design.

However, I'm also willing to learn at the same time. If this guy has indeed the power he's claiming - then we all could stand to learn a few things (this includes myself).

So to the OP, what is it you are doing differently to get such high numbers with what seemingly seems so little?

 

+2

 

Cars looking good, cant wait for next frieday

 

I'll just quote your respsonse as its the last one that questions Darkpahantom's numbers.... which is exactly the response we got when we posted dyno numbers a few years back. At 24 psi, 7300 rpm, pump gas w/ 300cc of meth, we put down 620 rwhp before we ran out of fuel. Had we any more fuel we could have easily seen 645-650 going by everything we had seen through spending the day on the dyno. This is using a GT4202. As Ernie has pointed out more than once, the "formula" that so many of you seem to refer to should be forgotten. The turbo is more than capable of making the numbers darkphantom is claming.

Going back to our day on the dyno, as we went from 19 psi to 24 psi, we gained 102 rwhp... which comes out to 20.4 rwhp per, and the turbo is just starting to get into its effiiency range. Going off of this, one might suggest that at 34 psi, we would be seeing 820 rwhp. This is still well within the usuable range of the GT4202.
Also, we are using an $100 Ebay intercooler with horrible square end tanks, and have a hideous kink in the IC piping just directly after the compressor outlet (the turbo was swapped and the shop had modified our IC piping to fit...) which is a huge restriction in the system. You don't need the most expensive parts to make power.
Our intake manifold is also stock. Ported, but stock. As Ernie has also said, a new intake manifold would be good for over 50 rwhp at this level.... at 800rwhp, even more so.

800+ is doable, I'm not sure why this is being questioned. Is Darkphantom making 730 or whatever it was? Who knows, but its completely possible. 23 psi on E85, better intake manifold, 9500 rpm... seems legit to me.

 

I just can't figure out why you (and others) are taking it so personally. Either he made it, and it doesn't affect you unless you have the identical setup to him and aren't making the same power, or he didn't make it, and it doesn't affect you.

 

OR

Some of us might be interested in learning how to better our own setups by learning how he's able to make such achievements. . . You know, like we were part of a community to educate ourselves or something.

 

Why not run the dyno loaded, setup for rpm, show all corrections on the dyno to prove everyone wrong? For the most part the only thing in question here was how the dyno was loaded and run. Answer those questions and I believe the naysayers will be quiet.

 

Both jdmfantasy & Trots*88TII-AE* misunderstood my post and the point of it.

I'm just not understanding how the intake setup can allow for this much power gain. At my inital glance, this is roughly the only major difference i've seen (the intake setup). perhaps it's giving the engine an ability to free the motor in terms of ingestion abilities?

So.. assuming this is all truth - whats the lesson learned here? he is seemingly willing to share some information about the engine itself and porting,etc..

I'm always student, hardly ever a teacher.

 

Thanks to Zero R for compliment about my suggested airflow requirements of rotary vs. piston engine....
Turbo is more than capable for such output, math approach of certain people(bla bla divide by 1.3..... 1.92 CFM per HP...) is ridiculous.(unfortunately single turbo section is cluttered with this)

I highly recommend checking this thread, its ridiculous https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...hlight=700+e85

This guy was claiming that there is guy with over 700 rwhp at 20 PSI with 4x1600cc on E85 Car trapped 131 MPH and got beat up by 500 whp EVO.... Maybe this dyno shop is giving customers what they want

I´m sure that 90% people reading this thread know whats going on. Dyno isn´t loaded and there is huge correction factor.

Soon there will be new kind of people on internet, dyno queens of correction factor Cars will be free revving and power will be guessed from fully sick factor

 

I think a lot of it has to do with the trend of racing dynos lately. People seem more concerened with dyno numbers than real et's, lap times, trap speed, ect. Secondly, it muddys up the water for legitimate shops that actually use the dyno for what it was intended for (a tuning tool). Then all the sudden you get customers that are not happy because they didn't get "X" amount of power at "Y" amount of boost. Somehow they see the dyno number as a sign of the skill level of the shop instead of actually going out and using the car as it was intended to be used. As far as the turbo being capable to support the power, in my mind it's not a matter of capacity but rather the fact that he made the power at a much lower boost than anyone (i know of) ever has. All i can say is my port is much more aggressive, the fuel is much more volatile, and i am running the same intake and throttle body and am not even close to those HP levels at that boost.

 

Thats a very interesting and truthful view on the subject from a higher view. I appreciate reading insightful comments like this. Thanks!

 

You're absolutely right, and I never thought about it from the shop perspective. I just like to hope that people who are purely performance-oriented are able to see beyond dyno numbers, and specifically don't go around quoting figures from this thread as being the "bar."

 

You'd be surprised. I find myself having to explain the internet HP game every other car I tune and why 400 rwhp isn't exactly doable on stock twins without magic. And why a dyno number is completely meaningless unless its compared on the same dyno, and even then weather can affect the readings or if the dyno's calibration has changed, also is rpm being read off the wire or being calculated by wheel speed which changes when the tire expands at wot. There's SO many factors that can affect a dyno reading.

I completely agree with 13B-RX3 and mention it every time. A dyno is a tuning device, not an accurate measuring device.

thewird

 

Dyno drags are pretty big here in the midwest. You can't exactly yank the wheels but it's easy on parts

 

+1000

i hate to brake it down to you brotha but those numbers are just not real. maybe @ 30-35 psi but def not @ 20-23.

 

darkphantom..... don't sweat it.

 

i don't know why this is such a big deal to you guys.
if you were sitting passenger seat, you would shut up real quick at WOT.
i personally don't believe its that powerful either.
that doesn't mean its not fast as ****!!
darkphantom, do you ever take your car to the local meets, like towers?

 

Just so it's clear it's not a big deal to me, nor was I saying the turbo can't flow over 740whp or the OP is full of it. The turbo is good for low 800's if he is somehow getting the numbers the shop claims (more important part) at the boost level he claims 20-23psi the turbo will not support the flow at higher boost levels period, it will drop off quickly.

I'm with 13B-RX3 and everything he stated. Here is my main concern, if this dyno or shop (lets stick with dyno and not point fingers) is giving false or inflated numbers that only hurts the customers in the end. It isn't fair to them. I say go to another dyno for his sake not mine. I personally have no stake in the car.

~S~