bond007

Stay away from Millenium. I get the ******* every time I think about them. I swear I saw that car in for service (which means their meatheaded mechanics probably buggered it up) when I unfortunately had to go pick up a part from them.

I would also stay FAR away from an automatic RX-7 not necessarily because of the transmission being a slushbox, but they will "act funny" when the motor wears out unlike a manual, and not in a friendly way (they stall and are more or less undriveable once the motor is low on compression, where a manual you can "get away" with it).

They are all fun cars, but you may not like a FB because they are hard to find at a reasonable cost in good condition. I sold my FB to a good friend because he needed a car more than I at the time. I miss winding that 12a motor past the redline (and usually hearing the rev buzzer for a few seconds) every day. Bulletproof little things they are, 3rd gen power they have not, but that can be fixed with a lot of money that you will never ever get back out of the car when you sell it. Same with ANY modded car. If you know you want to do mods on a car, I would find one with the mods that checks out okay and pick it up for a song compared to buying the car and THEN paying for the mods/installation.

I don't know why I haven't owned a FC. Oh yeah, that's right. My good friend owns enough of them for the both of us (I lost count, it's well over 6 or 7 cars + parts cars) and I've spent enough time working on them to know that they can be just as much trouble as a FD.

I don't know you (and your mechanical ability) or what your budget is, but realistically, I would plan on spending at least $15,000 on a FD to get one that will last you about a year before something breaks or needs attention. Even a FD that I knew the past two owners of had some major deficiencies that my friend had to fix fairly close to his purchase date. A FC or a FB is a much better choice for most folks and it would be a good thing to pay someone to put it on a lift and look over it if you aren't experienced.

GTUser

Hey guys, once you surrender to the calling all the tension and anxiety goes away. Owning and driving an FC is a pure delight 'cause you know you can acheive nothing better. There is no longer that drive to improve and enhance something that you know needs the enhancements. After all an FC in any version is as close to perfection as we mortals are likely to experience this side of heaven.

Come on in the driving is fine!

MaxDuo

I don't know why I haven't owned an FC.... Oh wait, yeah I do. Things always mess up

GTUser

Have you just called FB & FC owners mechanically less qualified than FD owners and FD owners financially irresponsible for purchasing their 7s and wanting to improve them and keep them in top running condition?

If we didn't enjoy working on our cars then we'd be driving a Honda, Toyota, Acura, or a Lexus. Most of us enjoy the challenge of keeping our cars in as good a condition as we can, I mean, after all, we no longer have to kill a wooly mamouth to get thru the winter, or build our own shelter, or even hunt and gather our food everyday. We need some critical challenge in life and some of us have chosen to own and care for a rotary powered wonder. When they are running and looking good they confirm our mastery over all things complicated and mysterious.

But again, thanks for the inspiration.

NCTII87

i think that if FC owners didnt know how to work on their cars then there wouldnt be any out there on the road. i also think that FD's do break all the time* cough cough* haha- whats wrong with your car ashraf?

GTUser

Dave do you or Steve know any place over in your area that can help Brent out with his annual state required intrusion in to his personal realationship with his FD? If so, please PM him with the information if you don't mind.

Thanks,

NCTII87

i know steve knows people but he's out of town til monday. i'd try that little thing we were talking about at the meet the other night. rick mentioned running the airpump strait into the cats and blowin fresh air into the exhaust- that would make it run clean enough if not cleaner than it needs to pass.

AntiVenom7

everyone needs to move out to johnston county. no airpump, midpipe, whatever. all they care is that your lights turn on.

blacksupra94

So steve can get me somewhere that will " hook me up"? BTW , I have no cats.

FD3sAutobot

iTrader: (6)

Your right.... you dont know me . If I wanted to spend 15,000$ on a FD I'd go get a loan right now, but no I'm doing the SMART thing and saving my money to pay for it outright. A future FD owner should know (through research) that a FD is NOT just your average sports car (or any gen. RX-7 for that matter) and that it needs more than a little bit of TLC.
I know what kind of **** I'll probably run into when I purchase my seven thanks to the positive members of this forum. I'm confident enough in myself to work on my own car. I've worked on a couple older cars (73 dart,69 charger) and my civic ,thats it. I have no experience what so ever working on a rotary engine/car.... does that mean I should take it to a local shop? Or you for that matter? **** NO.
I was seriously considering a FCTII , until now. Now that you've made that statement above, I've made my decison... I'm not changing my name

I'm done ranting... its 02:10 and I need some ******* caffeine...

MaxDuo

Hey hey, I think I've found what would be my future home!

bond007

No. That's not what I said (at least not what I meant and not what _I_ see upon reading in the original post). Somehow, what I type on here NEVER carries what I mean. Too much fact, not enough fluff, I guess.

If you are planning on modifying a car, save money and buy one with the mods. Much cheaper but it has its caveats. All cars in all states of modification will require attention. It's just that the Honda/Toyota/etc. "appliance-owning" folks that aren't as aware of their vehicles and can "get by" and let the maintenance lapse (although their cars suffer just the same). The more high-strung a car, the more you have to pay attention to it.

About now, I am wishing that I had about another $10-15k in the bank to "blow" and I would just sell my car and buy a track-prepped car with all the bugs worked out so I can go and drive/track it instead of it sitting in the garage waiting for parts/installation/debugging (some of that is taking too long because I want to do it right the first time and not have to re-do stuff, like the first rollbar I ended up selling and shelled up mucho $$$ for the "correct" piece).

Some days, it seems life was be so much simpler (and cheaper) when I was an ignorant "appliance" driver.

bond007

One of these days, I'm going to start an RX-7 charity to buy a good, working, cat for all 3 generations so you can just borrow it for the afternoon and dispense with this (smog for older cars may be no more in '06).

Still, a car that doesn't pass smog isn't just an inconvenience/intrusion to us. Something is wrong with it and you should make an attempt to fix it. It may actually help your performance since you are probably running too rich (why you fouled out the cat to begin with).

I just read that 20% of smog problems in the past was attributed to fuel evaporation (vapor recovery system). That is such a simple and innocuous system and it doesn't cost horsepower. It is such a shame that people rip it out and could be helping the air quality without doing much. I'm not an "environmentalist" but I do believe in taking reasonable measures to help especially when they are low cost and not much of an encumberance.

bond007

1) There is no need for superflous cursing. It only enhances your immaturity.
2) I was just trying to help. That is why I said I don't know you and was stating that your case and others may be different, but I think too many people have in the past abused RX-7's (which is why our supply of them is "tainted" compared to what you find in the Supra community) and taken them for granted. Not everyone DOES the research. How many times do you see the same tired basic question in the various forums and STILL no one researches despite there being a good response only a few keystrokes away? Apparently the only way to win is to keep restating it, which is basically what I was doing.
3) "Thanks to the positive..." -- tongue-in-cheek that I am negative? Far from it, just trying to keep someone from getting in way above their head, as I have seen the same unfortunate story many times over. It seems that no one likes to get a reality-check before their empty bank account gives it for them.

I think I've had enough fluff for the day. Time to read some technical stuff.

tookwik

Ahsraf, why do you make so many assumptions in regards to stereotyping rx7 owners?

bond007

You can have a car that is:
a) reliable
b) cheap
c) fast

but only two of the above criteria.

I want A & C for track use.
B is the problem.

I got 3 years of trouble-free operation on a car with 66k when I bought it. I tracked and autocrossed it....HARD....and spent little in terms of money on mods. I only had a downpipe and catback (no radiator, none of the other stuff that FD owners normally buy, because I kept close tabs on the car). I'd say that is better than the average track record.

Specifically what's wrong?
My turbos are shot. I'll bet that the prior 3 owners didn't take care of them and change the oil as often in those initial 66k mile as I did (2k interval changes for me). I'm on the original engine at 89k (and I'll bet the turbos were why it was so weak above 6000rpms).

It is taking so long because I don't want to "throw away" money on rebuilding them (on another resource I know two credible individuals who bought rebuilt turbos and they didn't even get 200 miles out of them) and I don't want to buy an overpriced single turbo kit. That's a nasty dilemma for keeping getting your car running. I prefer to take my time and make a good decision about the problem and I'm having to do a lot of research myself because I don't trust what I've read about the prospective solutions to a rebuild or a single turbo.

Stereotyping? How about reality? How many folks do you know that have dropped as much money on a first gen as a 3rd gen owner typically does? I only know of one. David Lane. How about a 2nd gen? I know of one, George Samuels (20B conversion). Few and far between. It isn't stereotyping, it's reality.

Again, I can't apologize enough if what's being typed is coming out wrong or someone misreads it, but I'm not knocking the FB/FC's. I think that very few folks realize how expensive a FD is to properly maintain. I'm NOT the only one saying this. If you venture to the 3rd gen forum, I'm sure there are others (some of which I know from the e-mail list) that are repeating what I'm saying. Who replaces ALL their cooling hoses before putting a downpipe on?

B from above is also why I keep warning folks about 3rd gens. Mods costs about 30-50% more than it would for a FC for what is almost virtually identical hardware. If you crave speed, then you can do a lot more with your money on a cheaper car that is just as fun.

In fact my FC friend and I finally after 4 years figured out why he doesn't really like the FD: it isn't "fun". It is a precise "machine" -- surgical precision. It isn't like a FC/FB/Miata that has lower limits where you can toss it around and "have fun". The limits are SO high on a properly maintained 3rd gen that you DEFINITELY better be on a racetrack exploring them and not on the street and even then, you had better be Hans Stuck when you are going around a corner full-tilt-boogie and the back end steps out -- your reaction is going to be more critical when you are going 120-140mph than 80-100mph in a slower car.

Perhaps I'm too descriptive online and a little more amenable in person for those who have actually spent some time with me when I can fully explain what I'm saying. I dunno.

tookwik

Your just too damn critical of people and their FD's. Your absolutely right that a lot of 3rd gen's are going down the drain because they fall into the wrong hands... and that this doesn't happen with Supras even half as often. The simple truth is understood when you look at the price. In general an equal comparable supra will outprice an rx7 by a good $10k. Who cares about going around a turn at 80-100 or even 120-140...??? I will guarantee that maybe not even 5% of 3rd gen owners will ever get to experience that and truthfully, even think about doing that. We get our cars because they are beautifull, we love our cars because we spend so much time with them, and I modify mine too satisfy my evergrowing need for speed. I don't even know if I reached my point in that little paragraph. But... Now all I ask is if we can please stop all this "every rx7 should be tracked ideal"?

Did you ever think that some people don't put their car through hell? like it seems that you do to your cars?

And last of all, it is very possible to buy a perfectly working 3rd gen for $15k... and I think by now, all the people in this thread thoroughly know the expenses of an rx7... fb, fc, or fd.


Excuse all that please. I had to rant.

Smoken'

iTrader: (1)

yeah guys, i'm out of town right now in atlanta. I will get caught up on this thread hopefully later tonight. On a side note, anybody that is looking for an fd, i talked to somebody that said that bruce turentine had one with a streetport for 10.5k. later....

GTUser

Thanks everyone for the thoroughly entertaining comparison of FBs, FCs, and FDs the many passions of rotary owners. I enjoyed the discussion and exchange of ideas.

Ashraf, I understood the point you attempted to make in your first post and was trying to point out how it came across to me and obviously to others. I appreciate your input and your perspective on sports car ownership and use, but it is YOUR perspective.

Most people own and care for an RX7 or 8 for that matter because they get joy and pleasure from what they are doing. We don't relate to our cars by cost/benefit ratio, or in a totally logical and thoroughly practical way. Most of us are passionately attached to the car because it is somewhat unique and driving a rotary sports car fast is a thrill; we get a lot of personal satisfaction maintaining the car and just looking at it. I know that when I drive mine, and I've owned it for right around 4 years, I am happy just to be in the car. When I park it, I always turn to look at it one more time as I walk away to admire its lines and style and to remind myself that it is MY car.

I see this same attitude in most of the guys who do the drive-ins, why does Johny drive down from Virginia to hang out with other 7 owners, why do guys come up from Fayetteville and over from G'boro to hangout? Why did Andy drive over from Cary and why does Dave go out of his way to recruit new members? We have a special bond with our cars and enjoy sharing this with others who share our passion and interests.

Bert

Johny zoom

iTrader: (5)

Bert, Im getting all choked up, Tell me again why I ride 2hrs? Actually its because I like seeing all the ricers on capital, or could it be the "Quality time" I 've gotten to spend with N.C.'s finest. J/K
You're right Rotary owners are a different breed of people, who else would spend $110.00 on a watch because it has a rotor on it and I still cant tell what damn time it is.
Steve
I have 1600cc injectors and a s-afc I will contact you soon about helping me installing these and setting the s-afc up.
Ashraf
You seem to come off a little arrigant to me even in person, I'm not trying to dis but thats how I see it.

oneevilwankel

yeah so a guy came into my work today and told me about this..so i figured i would get on here and ask about all the details..so i got that its at the char-grill on strickland rd..but thats about it..so someone fill me in on the rest and i will try to see if my car will be able to carry me that far..lol

AJ

Smoken'

iTrader: (1)

Welcome aboard oneevilwankel, look forward to meeting you at one of the upcoming drive-ins. We have a lot of good guys out there that like to talk and try to answer any questions you might have.

Steve

Smoken'

iTrader: (1)

Those some pretty fricken big injectors, its probably a lot more then you will need. You gonna be at any of the upcoming drive-ins? We will talk about it then and you can tell me what your plans are for the car. See ya....

Steve

NCTII87

wow, haha, im glad you guys finally rebelled against the *****. was gettin kinda tired of hearin my miata is the baddest bitch on earth... although, you did a good job considering.... hmm...
on another note- welcome AJ- i assume ken probably told you? red GXL with black wheels? he's goin to vance granville now so i figured he was the one down your way. im in bahama so not to far away from you.
johnny, woah, 1600's are kinda overkill. jeezus! haha! 720's are plenty. 1600's are for like massive turbo's and such.

NCTII87

steve get your *** back here damn it! there's nothin to do in durham! we need another car to work on. anybody got anything wrong with theirs?