gmaz

I got this log in before I blew the motor, I wish I had of logged some other things.
O-well!

I'm still trying to make a timming map with what info I got, in PLviewer in the windows data at the start of the log where I'm at around 1000rpm it says timing -.6 deg but in the leading timming map, which is stock timing does not go down to -.6 so where did these numbers come from?

also what should I have logged to give me the best info on creating a timing map?

and I'll post my TPS log it seems wierd

The car was running lean on the top 12.9AF and I took out the front rotor, didn't even hear the detnation but felt the timing retarding under knock, just hope I didn't take out the turbo.

If someone could check out the log and maybe see somthing I don't that may help,
thanks for any help.

now it won't let me post the LOG I'll try to get it on here.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Not sure why you are so worried about timing since it seems the lack of fuel is the bigger problem. The stock timing maps aren't that bad. No need to reinvent the wheel. Just pull a few degrees out up top. But get your fuel right first! All the timing tuning in the world isn't going to save a motor running lean.

I'll look at the logs tomorrow.

gmaz

I was worried about timing because, before I had the rtek 2 I had a SAFC and the rtek 1.5 and I had plenty of fuel for the boost I was running, which boost was creeping to 16 psi but my AF was still low 11's, so I thought I would need to do something with timing because the rtek 1.5 has the timing retard but the rtek 2 you have to manualy change the timing and I'm not sure where to retard the timing. That is why I was concerned about timing!!!!

I can't comment on the stock timing maps being good or bad from what I do know stock timing is not the best for safety and that is what I was looking for!!!
My timing at full out in third gear was something like 36 degs this to me seems like to much as I have looked through alot of haltech maps and not one has the timing under full boost and high RPM's anywhere close to 36 deg's.

I'm not saying the rtek has anything to do with me blowing my motor, but maybe you can tell me what I need to log next time so I can get a good idea for a timing map?

and yes I will be getting the fuel figured out first!!

thanks

gxl90rx7

iTrader: (1)

looks like you have the 3800 rpm hesitation too

gmaz

I didn't notice that but I'll take a closer look, thanks.

what is bugging me is that my old setup, being SAFC and rtek 1.5 with everything the same I had enough fuel for 16psi and now with the rtek 2.0 I don't have enough fuel??

also the SAFC was only adding 15% fuel ?


that what is confusing me.

O-well thats the way it goes.

cheers

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Where do you see this?

Whats up between 8 and 11 seconds? Is that wheel spin in first?

Henrik noticed your TPS is not reading full scale. This would keep flood clear from working. You should make sure it's properly adjusted as per the FSM.

The spikes could indicate a dirty or bad TPS. Instead of mashing it, slowly press it to the floor and slowly release it. The log should be a smooth "hill". If there are spikes in it, get a new sensor.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

I assume you removed the AFC prior to installing the Rtek stage 2?

Did you set the Rtek's fuel correction to +15% like the AFC was?

You had a 1.5 so I assume you are running 550s all the way around?
You had the Rtek configured for 550/550?

gmaz

yes wheel spin

I though the TPS was not set, would this cause less fuel in the top RPM range?

and no I run 680cc pri and 800cc sec and had it set to 720/720, had the fuel plus 15% in the boost part of the map.

and yes I am not using the SAFC anymore.

boost was 13 psi

thanks

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Ahh, theres why you were lean.

You moved from the 1.5 (which doesnt compensate for larger injectors) to the 2.0 set for 720/720 which leans the mixture about 25% to compensate for the larger injectors. So, not even accounting for the AFC correction, you went from +45% more fuel (800cc + v1.5) over stock to 12% more fuel over stock (800cc + v2.0 seto for 720).

Or you can think of it this way. Stock (with the 1.5) you had 800cc with the ECU expecting 550, so you had an additional 250cc ( 800-550) over stock. With the 2.0 set for 720, you were only 80cc over stock (800-720). Thats a pretty big difference.

No the improperly set TPS has little to do with fueling (to a point).

The Wankler

iTrader: (14)

When I just installed the 2.0 in mone, it got rid of the 3800 hesitation. That was one of the first things I checked.

gmaz

From what I understood was when set to 720/720 the ECU would now just lower the duty cycle, allowing the ECU to add more fuel to keep the AF around 11 to 1, now if AF got higher I could then add more fuel in the map up to 15%??

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Yes, sorta. Set to 720s, the ECU will remove roughly 25% from the calculated injector duty cycle to compensate for the 25% additional fuel being squirted by the 720s. This will maintain near stock AFRs mathematically which may or may not be suitable for the boost you are running. The compensation will be carried up through the airflow range, but the ECU is not closed loop at WOT, so there is no way to say it will maintain a good AFR for all boost/airflow conditions. Every car is different, so the need for a tuning and monitoring with a wideband is still there.

As described previously, your previous setup was running much more fuel because no injector compensation was being done. If your AFRs were good with that setup them moving to the 2.0 and configuring it the way you had it would definitely make it run lean.

If you aren't understanding this, please let me know and I'll try to explain it better.

gxl90rx7

iTrader: (1)

the secondary flag jumping on/off

Here is a log of my hesitation, just accelerating in 1st and 2nd, up to about 0psi boost. i figured the secondary flag toggling on/off was causing it

gmaz

No, I understand it alot better now. thanks.

I just wish I realized this sooner, O-well

thanks for the help

fstrnyou

can anyone with the rtek 2 post up the stock S4 timing tables? i plan on using MegaSquirt n Spark - Extra on my 88 TII. figured i could use a real baseline timing table to tune off of rather than just guessing or using a table from another MegaSquirt user who probably made up numbers.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

The secondary flag would not "cause" hesitation, but it might provide clues as to why its hesitating. The Secondary flag is just that, it indicates the secondaries are on. When the secondary flag goes high, the IPW will drop by about one half (assuming pri/sec injectors are the same) so the AFR stays the same, but with 4 injectors injecting.

What you see isn't a problem, it's what is causing the secondaries to turn on and off. For this I would look at the TPS. You didn't log TPS, but I would be curious to see TPS, RPM, IPW, and sec flag.

As for the timing tables, get an Rtek. There is no way to extract them without manually copying the 700+ values.

fstrnyou

well, with 700+ values, sounds like it would be a bitch to tune. isn't there some sort of graphical chart. oh well, thanks anyways

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

Heh, if you think the rtek will be hard to tune, good luck with the MS...especailly since it doesn't come with the stock maps already programmed...

You mean like this?

IAN

iTrader: (3)

That looks hard to read. I am using a haltech so I don't know anything about this. Just interested in converting maybe to stock or just selling the car cause of Emissions so I thought I would take a look at the rtek. Reason why I say its hard to read is on that graph how do you tell what boost you are in to adjust the timing. Can you adjust while driving or all adjustments are made offline. Sort of looks like stabbing in the dark? Overall looks like a cool system.

Maybe I should read up more on this?

GOTBANNED?

sorry read why u selling the car..i'm sure u can get an e-test somewhere

IAN

iTrader: (3)

Dam dude. How the hell you post that fast after me. Didn't think another person so close to me would be readng the section

Its all about emissions at this time. I don't want to have to battle it. Just researching options.

fstrnyou

yes, that's exactly what i was talking about. only the Table version and not the map version. all i have in MS is a MAP vs RPM table. and i think a timing split table or something. haven't really dug into the guts of it yet. i'm still learning the system.

turbo2ltr

iTrader: (1)

On that particular view, the dot indicates the cell your in as well as the labels at the bottom. The timing maps in the stock ECU are Load vs RPM, not boost vs RPM.

Check the screenshots on our site for other views.

GOTBANNED?

i'm sure u can pay for one..