NRS Rotorsports ceramic seal test results
12-26-07, 09:29 PM
#401
It's the rest of the combination that's the problem.
It never seems to amaze me the amount of fuel these little 'kegs' for a motor can swallow or shoot it right out the exhaust!
12-27-07, 06:44 PM
#403
Performance Veteran...
Please keep us posted as to all the latest developments/achievements running the ur state-of-the-art gray material ceramic seals (i.e. HP & 1/4mile records,etc.) and let us know when you expect these "new material" stronger seals to be ready for testing* Maybe these new even stronger pieces will be 'detonation proof'!? 
12-27-07, 11:43 PM
#404
The tiles from the space shuttle should be!
Then again someone else allready tried that with their brand of apex seals!
With unbreakable apex seals what would be the next weak link? Rotors, housings, bearings?
Then again someone else allready tried that with their brand of apex seals!
With unbreakable apex seals what would be the next weak link? Rotors, housings, bearings?
12-28-07, 06:27 AM
#405
"Elusive, not deceptive!”
Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper GTSR
Maybe these new even stronger pieces will be 'detonation proof'!?
Yes, but how many runs does a piston engine make when producing 10 HP/cu in?
You guys are doing great pulling that much power at the track.
For the last few years I have been trying to develop "Goldilocks" power. To settle at a truly dependable HP set-up for extended street use. We have such a great sports car. We just need dependable power for it. I thought I had it till it spit another apex wedge tip. Time for NRS?
Barry
Originally Posted by Viper GTSR
Maybe these new even stronger pieces will be 'detonation proof'!?
You guys are doing great pulling that much power at the track.
For the last few years I have been trying to develop "Goldilocks" power. To settle at a truly dependable HP set-up for extended street use. We have such a great sports car. We just need dependable power for it. I thought I had it till it spit another apex wedge tip. Time for NRS?
Barry
12-28-07, 01:14 PM
#407
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Please keep us posted as to all the latest developments/achievements running the ur state-of-the-art gray material ceramic seals (i.e. HP & 1/4mile records,etc.) and let us know when you expect these "new material" stronger seals to be ready for testing* Maybe these new even stronger pieces will be 'detonation proof'!?
Detonation proof, lets not get carried away
01-04-08, 11:17 PM
#410
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^^
Still waiting to see if we can salvage half of them in 3mm.
All out of 3mm 1pc seals now. Will be a while before more are done as we move into the new material.
We're getting a set of 3mm 1pc ready for Ernie in the new material. Once I'm happy with how they are then I can arrange for a big order of the new material and 3mm 1pc are first on the chopping block.
Still waiting to see if we can salvage half of them in 3mm.
All out of 3mm 1pc seals now. Will be a while before more are done as we move into the new material.
We're getting a set of 3mm 1pc ready for Ernie in the new material. Once I'm happy with how they are then I can arrange for a big order of the new material and 3mm 1pc are first on the chopping block.
01-05-08, 04:40 AM
#411
^^
Still waiting to see if we can salvage half of them in 3mm.
All out of 3mm 1pc seals now. Will be a while before more are done as we move into the new material.
We're getting a set of 3mm 1pc ready for Ernie in the new material. Once I'm happy with how they are then I can arrange for a big order of the new material and 3mm 1pc are first on the chopping block.
Still waiting to see if we can salvage half of them in 3mm.
All out of 3mm 1pc seals now. Will be a while before more are done as we move into the new material.
We're getting a set of 3mm 1pc ready for Ernie in the new material. Once I'm happy with how they are then I can arrange for a big order of the new material and 3mm 1pc are first on the chopping block.
What ever happened to the two lonely scorpions that came back for a face lift and breast enhancement?
01-05-08, 11:32 AM
#412
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I'm going to be needing three sets of 3mm 1pc in the not to distant future so you better get the stil/mill going. Honestly I've been holding back waiting for the new material!
What ever happened to the two lonely scorpions that came back for a face lift and breast enhancement?
What ever happened to the two lonely scorpions that came back for a face lift and breast enhancement?
01-05-08, 01:31 PM
#413
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I have a question concerning the ceramic side seals. I was curious if you planned on some static testing on the junk seals? The ones that can't be saved.
I would be interested in the results of putting one in a vise and ever so slowly (and incremented) squeezing it while gaging the seal slot and doing it to the point of breaking at the back of the slot. Ceramic is very brittle and I think one would want the clearance between the apex seal and corner seal slot to be well under said break point. Maybe testing has already been done. If so, never mind.
This led me to another idea. A two piece ceramic corner seal. You would need a spring that supported both halves but I think something similar to this could be used. Not exactly it but you get the idea.
http://www.smalley.com/wave_springs/about_springs.asp.
I don't know just a thought. I like the looks of that Wavo spring for a one piece seal.
I would be interested in the results of putting one in a vise and ever so slowly (and incremented) squeezing it while gaging the seal slot and doing it to the point of breaking at the back of the slot. Ceramic is very brittle and I think one would want the clearance between the apex seal and corner seal slot to be well under said break point. Maybe testing has already been done. If so, never mind.
This led me to another idea. A two piece ceramic corner seal. You would need a spring that supported both halves but I think something similar to this could be used. Not exactly it but you get the idea.
http://www.smalley.com/wave_springs/about_springs.asp.
I don't know just a thought. I like the looks of that Wavo spring for a one piece seal.
01-05-08, 04:30 PM
#414
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Glassman-
Viper asked this question a couple times in his thread in the Single Turbo forum, but not getting any answer on it:
Again, how long will a properly tuned 13B running on AI and pump last that is SET AT 20PSI & 550RWHP the whole time.....obvously i won't be WOT the whole time as its a street car but i will drive it day-to-day hard* ....i'm looking for >25,000 miles on the motor. Pipe dream or has been done* ??
Can you answer his question two diff. ways? 1) Assuming use of OEM seals; and 2) Assuming use of NRS seals. Thanks!
Viper asked this question a couple times in his thread in the Single Turbo forum, but not getting any answer on it:
Again, how long will a properly tuned 13B running on AI and pump last that is SET AT 20PSI & 550RWHP the whole time.....obvously i won't be WOT the whole time as its a street car but i will drive it day-to-day hard* ....i'm looking for >25,000 miles on the motor. Pipe dream or has been done* ??
01-06-08, 11:58 AM
#415
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Will let you know in about 25,000 miles
Pete just finished tuning an NRS powered RX2 on pump gas and WI. They won the summernats dyno competition. Pete has a pile of data from the VBOX and once I can get it all together in logical form I will post the results here and on the AI forum.
Last edited by Glassman; 01-06-08 at 12:00 PM. Reason: added quote
01-06-08, 01:58 PM
#416
Performance Veteran...
Funny you should ask.
Will let you know in about 25,000 miles
Pete just finished tuning an NRS powered RX2 on pump gas and WI. They won the summernats dyno competition. Pete has a pile of data from the VBOX and once I can get it all together in logical form I will post the results here and on the AI forum.
Will let you know in about 25,000 miles
Pete just finished tuning an NRS powered RX2 on pump gas and WI. They won the summernats dyno competition. Pete has a pile of data from the VBOX and once I can get it all together in logical form I will post the results here and on the AI forum.
01-10-08, 08:27 PM
#417
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Mazda vs Pagani Zonda?? 650+RWHP RX2 on pump gas and WI
Here is some VBOX data on Jake's Capella taken from Ausrotary including Pete's comments and a link to the thread. This car made 3 runs in the finals at summernats making 563 RWHP, 582 RWHP and 588 RWHP respectively. This was done on a Dyno Dynamics so for Dynojet the figures would be approx 647 RWHP, 670 RWHP and 676 RWHP respectively. Done on NRS 3mm 1pc
DEFINITELY READ THIS THREAD FOR THE FULL STORY ON THIS CAR AND FULL SIZE GRAPHS Pgs 5 - 6
Also a pile of info, links etc for the Racelogic VBOX
http://www.ausrotary.com/viewtopic.p...&sd=a&start=80
Highest peak boost PUMP FUEL RICE RACING WATER INJECTED
DEFINITELY READ THIS THREAD FOR THE FULL STORY ON THIS CAR AND FULL SIZE GRAPHS Pgs 5 - 6
Also a pile of info, links etc for the Racelogic VBOX
http://www.ausrotary.com/viewtopic.p...&sd=a&start=80
Originally Posted by RICE RACING
"Proof of G *note its higher than I claimed
Boost is higher also, but cant give all detail but there is enough here to keep you interested, you will see true vehicle speed, rear wheel speed, rear wheel slip percentage and some other interesting stuff :laugh:
**note waving rpm line is due to wheel spin/slip** and struggling for traction, but still enough to out accelerate a Pagani Zonda
Boost is higher also, but cant give all detail but there is enough here to keep you interested, you will see true vehicle speed, rear wheel speed, rear wheel slip percentage and some other interesting stuff :laugh:
**note waving rpm line is due to wheel spin/slip** and struggling for traction, but still enough to out accelerate a Pagani Zonda
Highest peak boost PUMP FUEL RICE RACING WATER INJECTED
Originally Posted by RICE RACING
Specs on the Zonda 
totally crushed by a fully loaded ~1200kg *as tested* Mazda :laugh:
2005 Pagani Zonda C12 F Specifications - Specs
price $741 000 USD
engine Mercedes Benz M180 V12 w/Pagani Intake, Exhaust, Management Systems
position Mid-Longitudinal
aspiration Natural
valvetrain DOHC, 4 Valves per Cyl
displacement 7291 cc / 444.9 cu in
bore 91.5 mm / 3.6 in
stroke 92.4 mm / 3.64 in
power 484.7 kw / 650 bhp @ 6200 rpm
hp per litre 89.15 bhp per litre
bhp/weight 510.2 bhp per weight
torque 1057.54 nm / 780 ft lbs @ 4000 rpm
redline 7000
drive wheels RWD w/Traction Control, Self Locking Differential
weight 1274 kg / 2809 lbs
wheelbase 2730 mm / 107.5 in
length 4435 mm / 174.6 in
width 2055 mm / 80.9 in
height 1141 mm / 44.9 in
transmission 6-Speed Manual w/Twin Plate Clutch
0 - 60 mph 3.5 seconds
110kph to 144kph Mazda 13B turbo road car V's Zonda super car
totally crushed by a fully loaded ~1200kg *as tested* Mazda :laugh: 2005 Pagani Zonda C12 F Specifications - Specs
price $741 000 USD
engine Mercedes Benz M180 V12 w/Pagani Intake, Exhaust, Management Systems
position Mid-Longitudinal
aspiration Natural
valvetrain DOHC, 4 Valves per Cyl
displacement 7291 cc / 444.9 cu in
bore 91.5 mm / 3.6 in
stroke 92.4 mm / 3.64 in
power 484.7 kw / 650 bhp @ 6200 rpm
hp per litre 89.15 bhp per litre
bhp/weight 510.2 bhp per weight
torque 1057.54 nm / 780 ft lbs @ 4000 rpm
redline 7000
drive wheels RWD w/Traction Control, Self Locking Differential
weight 1274 kg / 2809 lbs
wheelbase 2730 mm / 107.5 in
length 4435 mm / 174.6 in
width 2055 mm / 80.9 in
height 1141 mm / 44.9 in
transmission 6-Speed Manual w/Twin Plate Clutch
0 - 60 mph 3.5 seconds
110kph to 144kph Mazda 13B turbo road car V's Zonda super car
Originally Posted by RICE RACING
Now I am told the Capella weight on its own is 1100kg (add 190kg of people and equipment) and take into account it was tested at high altitude + at 35 deg C and you can guess how much real world power it has
Originally Posted by RICE RACING
This graph shows the trend of G from 110 to 160 and you can see the relationship of G fall with speed is roughly equal between the two (the drop off in G on the Mazda @ 160kph is due to rev limiter and resulting fuel cut followed by drop in boost), its just the Mazda is offset much higher, end result is it will get to its potential top with ease, in a much much shorter space of time and more importantly lenght of road ........ OR every single body panel will fly off, and the street tires will explode :!: (more like it LOL)
Last edited by Glassman; 01-10-08 at 08:55 PM. Reason: add dyno scan
01-10-08, 10:03 PM
#418
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Heres the scans above in order and full size with an extra one at the end:
Originally Posted by RICE RACING
Here is a good graph for you Jason, if your car can do 110kph to 150kph in 2.00sec or less while in one gear, then its super fast
graph notes: 25+psi boost 2.7bar abs, 35 deg C ambient day ....... pump fuel water injected road car in full street trim
graph notes: 25+psi boost 2.7bar abs, 35 deg C ambient day ....... pump fuel water injected road car in full street trim
Last edited by Glassman; 01-10-08 at 10:21 PM. Reason: added last graph
01-11-08, 04:12 PM
#419
And the Revolution...
Well I finally hopped on the bandwagon and got my *** in gear. I have some 3mm 2 piece seals and springs that will be going in my rebuild. Thanks again sven and I'm glad to be part of the revolution.
01-11-08, 05:06 PM
#420
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Just fired up Davin's motor with the NRS grey 3mm 1 piece. You wouldnt have thought it was a fresh build, started with zero drama . With zero miles and about 2 minutes of runtime, it pulled -350ish mm Hg at 950 rpm, not bad for a pretty aggressive streetport. Also, when on the stand, the motor really kicked back when spun with a long handled ratchet, I could tell it was going to make killer compression 
. With zero miles and about 2 minutes of runtime, it pulled -350ish mm Hg at 950 rpm, not bad for a pretty aggressive streetport. Also, when on the stand, the motor really kicked back when spun with a long handled ratchet, I could tell it was going to make killer compression
01-13-08, 12:08 AM
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I read the AusRotary thread and have a couple thoughts/questions:
Anybody know what the turbo specs are on that Capella? Half or full bridge?
Damn those Aussies can build/tune! 850*c (approx) EGTs on a 35*c day is impressively low. I don't recall the last time anyone on this forum posted their EGT data along side their massively over-inflated dynojet numbers. It sure does add a certain perspective when you add EGTs into the discussion.
Glassman, you called the aussie car "NRS Powered".... that alone adds like 50 extra horsepower on RX7club.com!!!!
Anybody know what the turbo specs are on that Capella? Half or full bridge?
Damn those Aussies can build/tune! 850*c (approx) EGTs on a 35*c day is impressively low. I don't recall the last time anyone on this forum posted their EGT data along side their massively over-inflated dynojet numbers. It sure does add a certain perspective when you add EGTs into the discussion.
Glassman, you called the aussie car "NRS Powered".... that alone adds like 50 extra horsepower on RX7club.com!!!!