Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

You are probably referring to the Fuel/ignition timing test function on the commander. That is only for testing and is a horrible way to adjust your maps for permanent use. You are correct that they reset every time you turn the key off.

Did you check your map sensor? How about a compression test? Neither one is hard to do and will tell you very quickly if you need to be worried or not.

Archangels

the map sensor seems fine, as for a compression test, i could do that later on today, was it the top plugs or bottom plugs i pull to do the test?...

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

it's in the FAQ. i don't think it matters which plugs you pull. probably whichever are easiest to get to for you. If you are using a piston compression tester, hold the valve open so you can listen and watch for 3 even pulses. Then release the valve and let it go for about 7 pulses for the peak number. Hold the throttle wide open and pull the EGI fuse. It's also best to have the engine at operating temps for accurate numbers, but really the important thing for you is to determine if an apex seal went by listening for the even pulses.

http://www.fd3s.net/compression_test.html
http://www.rotaryresurrection.com/3r...ion_check.html

Archangels

so far i have done the front rotor, i didnt hold the gas pedal down, there are 3 even and strong pulses and the front gives me 95-95-95....

i'll check the rear right away, stupid question and i know i should know the answer, but the trailing plugs are the top one's, correct?...

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Yes t for top. L for lower. easy way to remember it.

Archangels

well i'm back from the garage, i tried using the compression tester i have to the best of my abilities, i got 105 across the board for the front and back, i dont know about each rotor face since this compression tester is not a mazda and wont let me take the pin out to see each bounce although when i listened for the wooshes they sounded exactly the same....

the car is running like a bag of ****, and ofcourse to make things worse, i found that the engine builder didnt attact the vac. source to the oil injectors at all.... what kind of damage could have resulted because of this?...

ugh....

Archangels

also, i dont know if it makes any difference at all but i noticed the cells where it normally idles has changed, it's moved down about 4cells in the same area, not sure if that shows symptoms of a vac. leak or not?, i presume it would?...

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

sounds like map sensor still. if the idle is now 4 cells lower (on the map p rows) that would put it at atmospheric reading not vacuum. I am almost certain something is going on with your map sensor or the line going to it. Check it again! make sure the line has vacuum on it by pulling it off the map sensor. also take note of if the car runs differently with it disconnected.

The oil injectors like that will cause NO problems in this short amount of time and probably never unless you driver through dust storms. the amount of unfiltered air that could go through them is very very small.

Archangels

i checked and re-checked the line going to the MAP sensor and it's fine, i even replaced all of the hoses associated with it.... still the same thing....

i didnt check if it runs any differently with the hose off....

so the oil injectors not having a vac. source to them shouldnt matter for that short of time?, it wouldnt have suffered any internal damage?...

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

They don't see a vacuum source they see filtered air. You can put a small filter on them if you like. But for right now they are fine and will not effect anything. Test the map sensor according to the fsm. Something is not right with that. Go to the sensor check and verify the map sensor is not high lighted. Start the car and look at the pim voltage. Thats the map sensor voltage.

Archangels

PIM voltage is 1.75v at idle and HWL is highlighted....

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

well HWL is your exhaust warning light, that wouldnt effect the car.

and 1.75V PIM is showing that the car isnt pulling the vacuum it normally would if it was running correctly. The correct voltage for the map sensor of a properly running car is 1.3-1.6. On the other hand it isnt showing atmospheric pressure either (2.38-2.78V) which is what i was expecting. This most likely rules out the map sensor.

Turn just the key on (car not running) and you should see a PIM between 2.38-2.78. If you do then it seems to be working correctly.

Now you need to figure out if you are running on only one chamber. The easiest way for me to do this is... with the car running reach under the UIM and pull one of the primary injector clips off the injector. If there is no change in how the car runs then you have a problem in whichever side you just pulled the clip from. If the car dies then reattach and try the other injector clip. If the car runs worse in either case you most likely have a problem that is effecting both rotors.

Alternatively you can pull both plug wires from the front or rear rotor, then start the car and see if it effects how it runs in the same way. Personally i like pulling the injector clips while the engine is running because i can hear the effects immediately without having to remember how it ran 2 minutes prior compared to now. But some people dont have the room to pull the clips from the injectors.

Other things to test is make sure you have spark at all the plug wires, just use a spare spark plug. pull them one at a time and stick the spare in there, make sure the plug is grounded somewhere on the frame or engine, crank and verify spark.

Pull the plugs and see how they look, is either side soaked with fuel or carboned up?

This should be enough for now to get you on the right track to solving the problem

Archangels

i spoke with the tuner momentarily today, he said the cells it'd idling in are what we set them tune at the dyno, the vac. is definitly lower however....

i pulled the plugs and they were a little black, i had cleaned them up and replaced them, nothing changed....

i was suggested to do a proper compression test with a mazda tester since listening to the wooshes and using the compression tester i'm using arent valid ways to check the compression....

i have a bad feeling it's the worst case scenario, my luck isnt very good no matter what i do....

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

the compression tester method is accurate enough, provided you know what your doing while you do it.

Either you or the tuner is wrong.. It cant be idling in the same cells if the vacuum is different. (unless the vacuum is still very close)
Different vacuum levels are different locations on the map. p4 could be 16" of vacuum while p10 is at 0" or atmospheric. if it first had 18" and now it has 12" that means its now at a different spot on the map.

If you were getting even bounces on the gauge in a rhythmic and consistent form then your engine should be fine as far as compression is concerned.

Last week my rear primary injector burned up. Just all of a sudden my car ran like crap. I was in town at 10pm and all i had was a flashlight and a socket set. It took me 2 mins to determine it was the rear rotor not firing. 3 mins to realize the rear rotor had plenty of compression, And less then 10 mins to determine it was the injector or at least something associated with it.
The next day i checked the resistance on the injector and it was 0. got a set of injectors, replaced the bad one and all is well.

My point is that through some very simple tests you can narrow things down very quickly and figure out a plan of action. Any engine requires fuel, fire, and compression to run. So figure out which one is missing, and if it's front or rear. then go from there. Or take it to someone that works on these cars and let them go through the tests.

I wouldnt be surprised if the engine was blown considering the lack of tuning knowledge of the people doing the tuning, but based on what you said about the compression tests you did it doesnt sound blown to me. And if it's not blown take this as a sign of "what could of been" and get the car tuned correctly by someone that knows what they are doing.

Archangels

so i just got back in from the garage and stared at the car for a while trying to figure things out, after about 15mins i realized the headlights werent working, turn signals werent working, stereo quit on me and the car's running like crap....

so i pulled each plug to check for spark, the trailings had spark while the leadings had NOTHING, so i traced it back and realized the stereo, lights and my MSD box were all connected to the positive terminal on the battery, it was severely corroded....

i cleaned it all up, the stereo started, lights came on ( no turn signals still though ), and the car still ran like crap, so i'm thinking the MSD box has kicked the bucket or was burned up in the process....

so all in all, my leading coils are not firing, which results in my car running like ***....

also i did a compression test, the poor mans one, each compression "woosh" felt like the next and previous, probably doesent say much but it's what i could do at the time....

as for my leading coils not firing, idea's?...

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Since your trailing is firing switch the T and L signal wires at the coils. If you still get spark on the T you know that it isn't the wiring harness or the signal wire and that it is most likely the coil. If it switches and now your L fire but not the T then start at the short harness and work your way back. The connector on my short coil harness had 2 wires that needed soldered. I did continuity tests with an audible multimeter to figure out the problem.

Archangels

i used a spark plug wire from an integra and it still didnt spark or arc, it only will on the trailing coils and not on the leading....

i have an MSD6AL ignition, i think with whatever had happened that it torched itself as my positive battery terminal has a huge gouge in it now from something....

Rx7_Nut13B

iTrader: (1)

DUDE, I have read this ENTIRE post and it is just F'ed Up

OK listen closely, go back to the tuner, have him download map off powerFC, upload to web.... Have experts tell you 'OK' 'NOT OK'.........very simple

Ignition Problem... Leadings not firing? Pull POWER CONNECTOR (Small 2 wires, not plug wires) off one of the trailing coils, front back doesn’t matter, attach to Leading Coil (Twin pack) does Leading coil pack fire. If not then coil pack bad, if it does MSD box toasted.

You are going to loose all this help from people if you don’t listen

QUOTE udemaaanownsanrx7 "My point is that through some very simple tests you can narrow things down very quickly and figure out a plan of action."

This isn’t rocket science, you have all ready lost Chuck, BDC, and you are probably going to loose Dudemaaanownsanrx7, just because you cant do some simple stuff to work the problem out.

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

Yeah i was refering to the signal wire @ the coils not the spark plug wire

Archangels

i wasnt sure which wires you were talking about, i'll try it after work today....

should i be saying sorry the others arent posting any longer?, i dont have any way of posting the information you guys want me to and i was instructed by the tuner not too....

i'm not going to bag on the car anymore, i just want it to run properly so i can actually have my daily driver back....

as for going back to the tuner, i cant, he lives 2hrs north of here....

i have tried what everyone has suggested, i have done all the little tests, and i have narrowed it down to either the coil or the MSD....

Dudemaaanownsanrx7

iTrader: (23)

he probably suggested for you not to because he doesnt want everyone to tell you that he doesnt know what the hell he's doing. based on the information you have provided it doesnt seem like he does. So its probably just as well that you cant take it back to him.

But at least you have the problem narrowed down now. it shouldnt take much longer to determine what it is and fix it. If you're running an ignition amp on the stock coils its very possible the coil took a dump. They dont like the extra current. The T2 coils are more robust.

thewird

iTrader: (8)

So your posting in a PowerFC forum asking for help on your tune and to know if everything is right, yet you won't post your map because your tuner that you have to double check his work said not to?

thewird

twisted7

iTrader: (3)

edit

Archangels

yes i am running an amp on the leading coils, i will test them friday and see what i can find, it's tough working on the car in the cold when i get home around 7pm every day....

i will let you know how things go, but just so i understand, which wires from the trailing coil should i try on the leading coils?...

Archangels

Update Time....

checked the voltage on the rear coils with the volt meter with the key on the "on" postion and it read 11.75~v, checked the leading, 0.00....

so i unhooked the MSD from the system, hooked the leading coil back up with the leads, key to on, 11.76~v from the leading....

car runs like a top now, but you can notice the difference now without the MSD....

thanks to everyone who helped diagnose the problem!...