teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

this is a fresh rebuild on the car. it is an s4t2 with banzai adapter. current issues that the car is having:

1. the boost on the comander is reading -24 mmhg when the car is off and when the car "idles" it goes somewhere around -400 to -100. the setting on the computer is set for 3bar. is this a map sensor issue?? because on the commander it is jumping all over the place

2. when the car stood on at "idle" around 2k for a few minutes, then it started to lope up and down. the injector duty was reading 10% then 0% then back to 10. is the computer messed or it it a sensor somewhere?

3.lastly the timing was reading at around 25 on both leading and trailing with pretty much no split. why??

we just pretty much want it to idle so we can break in the motor and then get it tuned after.

sen2two

iTrader: (10)

I had a similar problem when I was running a PFC. You need to have a 3 bar map sensor. I was only using a 2 bar (which i thought was a 3 bar at the time). As soon as i switched to a GM 3 bar, all problems went away...

Did you modify the coils also?

I'm guessing your using a FD PFC since your using the adapter.

SSDTURBO2

this is what is on the commander. teddy is helping me work on my car.

SSDTURBO2

the map sensor that is on the car is a 3bar provided with the adapter kit.
yes the trailing coils were sent to banzai and they did them.

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

I heard that most poeple if not ALOT of people run a gm map sensor...B-lo my brother has a GM one here its a 3 bar...if i can find it we will try that...

I think that banzai one is a cheapo one

Coil packs are modified....

has a 3 bar map from banzai that came with the kit like mentioned above

siguy2k

iTrader: (3)

I've had similar problems. I had my map t-eed into a vacuum line. I ran a single source to map and it fixed it. Ive been using the banzai kit for a few years with no problem and I'm pretty sure it is a gm map. How old is your engine harness? Sounds like it could also be a tune issue.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

need more information to be sure. reading -24 mmhg without the engine on isn't necessarily too "off" depending on your altitude and the scale/offset setting used in the PFC. The MAP sensor calibration does not account for ambient barometric pressure and/or altitude. If there is a big mismatch in MAP sensor and MAP sensor calibration (it's set for a 2 bar but you have a 3 bar) it probably won't even run.

Datalogs will tell you more. It sounds like it needs to be tuned.

With idle ignition control ON (the default setting, not sure how yours is set up) The PFC uses the values in the IGL and IGT maps until water temps reach about 60C. You can see what cell it is using with the map tracer function in the Commander and in the Datalogit software. Once the engine warms up enough the PFC will engage idle mode where ignition timing is -5L -20T + engine load correction factor (A/C or electrical load, on s4 T2 adapter electrical load will only come on when the fan is set to kick in) + closed loop idle correction factor. The timing may appear to oscillate all over the place but it is actually falling within a particular and predictable range. See this post in my Power FC Commander guide:

https://www.rx7club.com/showpost.php...0&postcount=27

These old cars don't have electronic throttles like modern engines. So the throttlebody adjustment and air bypass screw (on the BAC valve if you have a USDM T2) greatly affect the idle. In short, it could just be a matter of getting everything adjusted properly both mechanically and in the software. Have you seen my FC3S Power FC guide on the Banzai Racing website? In the tech section of the Banzai website, look in the "Links with Other Handy How To's & Information" heading

On 2nd gens I like to connect the MAP sensor to the lower vacuum port on either the front or rear of the upper intake manifold. This will provide a steady vacuum signal from the plenum as opposed to a single intake runner.

arghx

iTrader: (3)

Also, there is nothing "obviously" wrong with the image in post #3. Water temp is below 60C so the ignition timing is based on the IGL and IGT maps. Idle rpm is high due to ignition timing and possibly the fast idle system/thermowax if you haven't gone ahead and removed it. Vacuum is about 17 inches mercury if you do the conversion which is within an acceptable range. It doesn't mean everything is good but I see no glaring problems based on that image alone.

Can you post a shot of your sensor check screen under the etc. menu? Also, verify that your o2 feedback is off in the function select screen. On the old green 80s-GameBoy-looking commanders there are funky japanese characters indicating on and off. On the new LED commanders it just says YES or NO.

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

Ok that is what i thought too... but when it started to lope i was like what the hell? The car cranks and turns on just fine...5 min's in is when it starts to lope..

Thank you all so much for the inpute and feed back...Tomorrow were going to set up the laptop get better read backs and post them...

If the mapsensor is a gm 3 bar then i guess we will leave it be...when the engine idle ran great till hits 50-60c thats when the car went into lope mode...

thank you again and please stay posted for more info that we will provide...were almost there..

The harness on the T2 is pretty fucked but is working at the current momment...

I will try another vacume source on the plennum...

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

Adjust your TPS to 1.00V on the commander. You have an S4 so did you follow the instructions and connect the FRT wire to the 3F wire?

Look for vacuum leaks if there are not any then add some fuel to the water temp correction screen at 50C

Get the car to 80C before making any changes to the base or inj maps.

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

that is I'm stuck at...How do i change the tps from 1.64 to 1.00v on the commander,

adding fuel to the water temp at 50C i have no clue how to do that...Im sure if i can get that 1.64V ont the TPs down i know for a fact the car will run like a champ, and idle like a champ...

thank you again for taking the time to look into this thread that really helped alot

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

Adjust the TPS like you normally would at the throttlebody screw, just watch the commander screen, the voltage will drop or raise.

Water Temp adjustments page 31 http://www.banzai-racing.com/store_i...werFC_FD3S.pdf

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

Okay thats what we were doing before by changing the tps from 1.64v and trying to get it down to 1.00v but there is always a loppy fluctuation when we even get it that close...I don't know why...

thewird

iTrader: (8)

The picture you displayed is perfectly normal and it looks like you have the right map sensor. It sounds like your issue is purely a tuning and throttle body setup issue. Do you have a wideband? Post your map.

thewird

arghx

iTrader: (3)

the thing that people don't realize is that getting it to idle and drive ok are often the hardest part. it's what separates the good tuners from the hacks. it's not quick and easy to figure all that out so you can take it in to an expert later.

SSDTURBO2

This is the sensor check with the key just turned on

SSDTURBO2

This is the monitor and sensor check when the car is "idling"

SSDTURBO2

So we narrowed it down the issue to be the map sensor because when we move the wires directly from the sensor it self the car goes crazy..

SSDTURBO2

We also put the tps at 1.00v

thewird

iTrader: (8)

What does that mean. lol

thewird

arghx

iTrader: (3)

There's nothing wrong with your MAP sensor. if there were, your vacuum readings or your Pressure Intake Manifold (PIM) voltage would be crazy. But they're not. 475mm/19 inches vacuum at a 2000rpm is within a normal range if you have stock or mild ports. Now if you are tugging on the harness that could cause a problem, but it is not the root cause.

Ok check this out:



Dark blue is a stock FD 2 bar MAP sensor calibration. Pink is one possible GM 3 bar calibration (scale 6630 offset 0 using FC-Datalogit 2.x units). 14.7psi absolute is atmospheric pressure. A "sanity check" of this chart shows that your readings make sense.

It still sounds like your car just needs tuning and throttlebody adjustment.

SSDTURBO2

ok thanks for the info..

ill try to post a video tomorrow to show what the car is doing. its kind of hard to explain.

thewird

iTrader: (8)

Don't forget to post your map with the video.

thewird

teddyrx2

iTrader: (33)

Ok so i guess it wasn't the map...But the problem is or was when that when we "GENTLY" move the map around not "jerk" or "yank" on it it was really sensitive cause the car to "Lope" jump idle then drop in idle and finally shut off...

The car for the most part is getting dialed in and is getting better "slowly" I found that his clutch on his stock fan was no good causing the water temp to reach 95C we installed a dull belt driven electric fan from a passat and that sucker is staying nice a cold where it needs to be...

If it is not the map, then maybe the issue lies at the throttle body...It just may screwed up or no good...

thank you all for all the help guys...

Banzai-Racing

iTrader: (11)

Look inside the old factory boost sensor connector, make sure there is no corrosion or lose terminals. Spray it with some WD40 if there is corrosion.