MeLoN350

iTrader: (2)

I was looking at maps on http://www.exorzero.com/skotx/powerfc and I noticed that on a lot of the maps, there will be negative numbers that just seem to be in the middle of nowhere. Like on rx7tt95 map, there is a -24 and all the numbers around it are 0, what does this setting mean amd what does it effect. I see these negative numbers are all in the vacuum side of the map.

Nick

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

Either bad data downloading by the SCRIBE who wrote the values to paper, or bad programming.

We who are fanatics have corrected the inconsistancies on our maps.

skotx

Regarding the error you mentioned, that -24 is in the Split table, cell N05/P06. We must look at the corresponding cell in the IGL and IGT to find the problem. In this case, IGL N04, 5, and 6 are 23, 2, and 27. I noticed this problem when I added the map to the site, but did not want to guess what the value should be. Since it's not in a critical area of the map, I will alter the value to avoid confusion in the future.

I agree with Chuck and would like to strive to make the available maps free from error.

1RedR1and1RedPEP

Since it was I that transcribed rx7tt95s maps from paper to .xls I will shoulder the blame if it was typed in error. I have in front of me right now the hand written maps from Michel. the value in the cell N5 P6 should be 26, this is for the leading map. the trailing map for N5 P6 is also 26. Sorry guys
1R1

rotorbrain

can somebody tell me what in the world the split table is

skotx

Split is the difference between leading (IGL) and trailing (IGT) ignition. Leading should always fire before trailing, so you want to see positive numbers or zero. Negative split occurs when this gets reversed and trailing fires before leading. You want to eliminate negative split. Someone more knowledgeable than me can explain the safest way to eliminate it, but I believe it's best to advance leading.

-Scott

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

You do not normally just advance the IGL to increase the split! IGL is set up first for max safe power for your boost and fuel settings, then IGT is set from there for your desired split.

Extra postive split is never dangerous, but extra IGL advance could blow your engine.

You look at the IGL trend for the affected area, if it is resonable, then adjust the IGT. Only adjust IGL if out of the normal. Look at the examples below.

IGL::::15,17,19
IGT::::05,17,09
SPLIT:10,00,10
It is obvious that the IGT cell of 17 that is causing the 0 split should be 7. Look at the IGL trend.

IGL::::15,12,19
IGT::::05,07,09
SPLIT:10,05,10
In this case the IGL of 12 is too low, see the IGT trend?

You have to do this type of analysis. Some parts of the maps are more confusing, especially in vacuum to boost trasistion, and where timing might actually drop off with revs because of hititng the max torque area. Look at this area from one of the base maps

19 19 20 21
16 15 16 18
11 9 11 14
9 7 9 12

rotorbrain

whoa thats some crazy stuff. man, is there a school for this stuff. hehe. im like th only person out here in middle Tn who has this i think. i dont get to talk to anybody else in person about this sort of thing. i was told to email spyfish007 in oak ridge, but he never answered. id like to meet up with somebody who can give me some schooling ya know. that stupid manual doesnt tell you anything. oh well, thanks guys.

paul

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

Spyfish007 (Carson) was in Dallas last weekend. Maybe he is still there. Just try again. We phone phone talk periodically.

R1 POWR

YES!!! That is definitely some crazy stuff.

sign me up for that "school", too i need to find an "Apex'i Power FC for Dummies" book

cewrx7r1 could probably make some $$$ if he wrote one. i know i'd buy one i don't know enough about the PFC, so i don't mess with any of the settings (except for the boost -- i lowered mine to keep it closer to stock levels).

however, i did figure out how the numbers in the SPLIT table were generated, although i didn't know what any of it meant

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

you guys are retarded
John

rotorbrain

hey jodeny, youre gay.

rotorbrain

sorry about that john. i just dont like bluntness. if you want to say something then it should be helpful. thats what most of us come here for. . . help. so why dont you heal me of my retardation (since you seem to be God), and tell me what is supposed to be going on.


oh BTW i checked some of your other threads and you seem to be a pretty unpleasant guy. . . you may want to work on that. it might get you more friends.

Lost Time

Hey guys, keep the hair-pulling and name-calling in the other forums, please.

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

I'm in extensive counseling. Did you figure out that 'crazy stuff" yet? LOL, I'll give you a hint, the leading timing is the TOTAL timing and the trailing is what determines the split. On pump gas you can run anywhere from 7 to 15 degrees split.
I AN NOT GAY!!!!!!!! Not that there's anything wrong with that. If I was I would be more sensitive to peoples' feelings
John

Rotary93

You have that much time on your hands to look up his other threads?

Damn Wish I had time like that

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

I thought the comment of "YOU GUYS ARE RETARDED"
was funny since it went along with the subject matter of the posts. I did not take it personnally.

spyfish007

This topic is a very controversial topic. The guys from down under run no split while american guys like to run the split mentioned above. This thread doesn't need to turn into a timing split conversation. If you are interested in this topic then do a search in the single turbo forum-you will find lots there.

rotorbrain

thanks guys, look jodeny i said i was sorry about the comment. . . and whats wrong with being retarded. hehe. im not trying to make enemies alright. and im sorry to the rest of the forum for puting all this s**t on here. im 20 years old, im supposed to act like that. hehe.


spyfish: im just gonna come see you and let you give me pfc tuning 101 alright. im not stupid . . . its just the first time ive ever messed with the parameters of an engine like this.

spyfish007

Sounds good to me.

duboisr

call garfinkle in murfreesboro tn he can help with the pfc and the pms

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

I agree with you somewhat but there is not nearly enough info about split in any forum. I have heard so many different methods by quite a few respected tuners. It seems to be a 'do what makes you comfortable" gray area.
John

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

Just for reference. I run the stock turbos(with all the mods) on 94 Sunoco pump gas at 17 pounds using 7-8 degrees split and the stock plugs! (7's and 9's) and injectors!. Two of the many tuners who I have spoken to said my engine should have blown years ago.... but I think that after my personal experimentation, this was the correct split to run. When I make it to a dyno I will increase and decrease the split using race gas in order to determine what makes the most power. Before I do that though I will try to figure out what TOTAL timing makes the most power and then adjust the split accordingly. It can get very complicated. I usually don't share this because the a few morons on the forum became jealous and started writing stupid things instead of trying to figure out how to use the info to get their car to run better.
John

To those of you whpo try this- be careful, this setup has lasted over 3 years but it is right on the edge of catastrophy

cewrx7r1

iTrader: (2)

John,

You are correct about widely different points of view about split. For NA engines 0 split was the rule. For
boosted engines, who knows. Riceracing swears on 0 split, while others say it hurts power.

I am running 10 degrees, and was to dyno test variations but on that day my leading coil input wire developed a loose connection at the ignitor where it was spliced. This caused the leading to fire erraticly.


Next time on the dyno, I will test split.

Jodeny

iTrader: (3)

Chuck,
Sounds like a good plan. I know you already know this but I'll write it anyway for others...... in order to decrease split you adjust the trailing timing and the leadiing timing is TOTAL advance.

John