Blake

I left a voice message for Ryan Scott. Never had any success in the past reaching him with PMs or emails, so hopefully the phone call will get returned. The guy is busy. Anyway, as I see it now, the one and only deadline is September 1st, unless you want to push it back further.

GoodfellaFD3S

iTrader: (213)

Is this a 52mm or 60mm gauge? If 60, I am interested.

Blake

52mm (2 1/16 inch). It is the only size available.

Blake

I have just received the fourth FIRM order, so I am prepared to just lower the initial buy-in at 4 instead of 5 to get things rolling. Perhaps that will get people off the fence. The initial orders will be processed tomorrow (Thursday, Aug 24th) and shipped immediately at the $225 plus shipping price. The September 1st deadline will stand for finalizing the GB price. If six more people come forward, making a total of ten orders, the price will drop another $10 and I will issue refunds of the balance to those who already paid the $225 price. At that point, the GB price is final regardless of the number of people who later chose to participate, though the GB may remain open indefinitely.

I have called Ryan twice and recieved no reply about making the GB official, as far as the Forum is concerned. Anyway, hopefully we can make that happen and move the thread over to the regular GB section, where more people are likely to find it. Even it it doesn't, the GB deal is firm...call it a 'sale' or whatever.

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

YAY, number 4 here!! haha

Come on guys, buy this baby!! If not, you in-formally re-voke your right to complain about the lack of rotary specific products from vendors lol

Can't wait to get my mitts on this unit - now I just need another gauge holder....

Blake

Okay, the orders I have in hand are processed and those going in the mail are getting picked up by the USPS in about an hour.

Tracking Info:

Joe: Global Air Parcel Post # CP039589375US
Daniel: Delivery Confirmation # 0103 8555 7497 5028 6690
Jon: Delivery Confirmation # 0103 8555 7497 6077 2459

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

Couple questions:

The EGT readings we will be getting will be higher than those of a single sending unit mounted after the turbo...correct? How much hotter should I expect them to be? Meaning (forgive me Im new to EGT's altogether) if a decently tuned single turbo FC is seeing approx. 1700-1800F after the turbo what should I be seeing one the duals to be comparable?

Basically what is considered a "safe" temp with about a 12.5:1 AFR?

Mr. Stock

I just payed with Paypal.
Order # 1200
Name is Edward Kim

Tim Benton

iTrader: (1)

You'll want to be richer than 12.5:1 anyway so your better off asking, what temp should I be seeing with an 11.0:1 if you want to be safe.

Tim

Blake

EGT has many variables, so it's hard to answer this question with any precision. However, turbo cars are generally pretty happy around 1400ºF at WOT under load. Stock NAs are usually around 1650, bridgeports 1750 and peripheral ports closer to 1850. Again, these are just starting points for tuning. Not only does AFR affect temperature, but so does ignition timing, the type of fuel and the distance of the probes from the exhaust ports. Before vs. after turbo readings usually vary 50-75ºF for cast manifolds and perhaps ~100ºF for a tube manifold. Again, many variables come into play.

For tuning, it is recommended that you initially use the dual EGT for checking the balance of combustion (within 50ºF is pretty good) and use wide-band O2 for AFR, then note the EGTs you are seeing for the known AFR. After that, you will have a pretty good idea of the temps you should be seeing for your targeted AFR. Once you know what is "normal" for your setup, you can easily spot anything abnormal should it occur. NA cars are much less sensitive to AFR, so EGT can be the primary tuning tool if that's all you have access to. For turbo cars, EGT is a suplimentary tool that tells you more than simple O2 can, but it does not replace WBO2 measurement. Consider it one more tool in the bag; not the only tool you need.

RXciting

Just Ordered.

# 1201

Blake

Got it, Francesco. Going in the mail tomorrow. Same for Ed (Mr. Stock).

We are currently up to 6 paid-in-full orders:

(1) Dan (dhcernese)
(2) Adam (afgmoto1978)
(3) Ed (Mr. Stock)
(4) Jon (jjshaloam)
(5) Joe (classicauto)
(6) Francesco (RXciting)

No deposits have been made so far, but that option is still open to those who don't have all the cash in hand.

Four more orders or non-refundable deposits by September 1st and the price drops another $10 for everybody.

R37ribution

Very nice well thought out post Blake, you sold me with your knowledge.

How much you need for a deposit?

Blake

$50, non-refundable. Balance in 30 days (or less). If you can't pay the balance in time or change your mind, I will allow you to apply the deposit towards another purchase from us, but no refunds will be made.

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

Thanks for the info Blake, I was mostly concerned about the temp. differential in regards to pre-turbo and post-turbo. Thats great! Thanks...

Anymore interested, gauge-obsessed folks out there? ???

dhcernese

a peek from an extreme angle shows how the needles move. sorry for the shallow depth-of-field.

EZFD

just ordered, #1202, what a great deal on a great gauge!!

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Blake,

I'm wondering how accurate these probes are and also how quickily they react. Do you have any specification of the temp probs? i do think it will suppliment to the tuning but not sure how practical if probes doesn't react fast enough and also can't be datalogged.

dhcernese

maybe the specs are somewhere: Hewitt Industries of L.A., part #015-003-B, thermocouple assy. They are only millivolt signals, however. The first "feature" listed is "fast response": http://www.hewittindustries.com/thermo.htm

Blake

That's a good question and I'll have to get back to you with any specs I can dig up, but generally EGT is not particularly fast reacting. You mainly use it for full-throttle, full-load tuning, which is of course the critical thing. Transitional readings lag.

I don't want to mislead anyone that EGT is better than WBO2; it's just a different tool with a different perspective. Used together for tuning, you have a better picture than either one can provide alone. WBO2 gives you the average AFR while Dual EGT gives you the combustion balance, plus insights into ignition timing, etc. EGT, alone, is the more economical means to monitor AFR on a day-to-day basis in a linear manner (unlike NBO2), but I would not rely on it exclusively for doing the critical tuning a of turbo car. Fortunately, pretty much any dyno tuning facility will have WBO2 capabilities, which is not always true for EGT, let alone dual EGT. I don't like WBO2 for day-to-day use...save the expensive, sensitive equipment for tuning.

As an analogy, if WBO2 is a finely calibrated torque wrench, EGT is that handy flex-head 1/4 drive ratchet with the assortment of extentions and u-joint sockets that you reach for on a daily basis and wonder how you ever survived without it. Each has a job, but one is more practical, one more precise; both belong in your toolbox.

Blake

Eric (EZFD) is the 7th paid order. Now, counting the gauge I owe Ric Shaw (not part of the GB) and the others we sold prior to the GB, that depleats the initial stock I had on hand. More gauges can -- and will -- be ordered, but it will add a few days to the orders from this point forward. So, instead of getting the gauges in about 3 days after your order, it will be more like a week. Just a heads-up...

Juiceh

iTrader: (4)

Man, I wish there was a 3 rotor model available. I may be interested in one of these in the future. As usual, another nice lookin product from you guys.

Blake

We can sell just the probes if you want to datalog the signal. Or, you can buy two kits to run one on each primary plus one after the turbo, for the 'big picture'.

R37ribution

Datalogging would be a nice feature...

Where do I make the deposit?

Blake

Again, datalogging may or may not work...it depends on the datalogger. Microvoltage is very sensitive to current being drawn off. If the datalogger is truly digital, no problem. If it's not, it can induce an error in the readings. This is straight from Hewitt Industries. Having not done it myself, I cannot say what systems are compatible or effective.

Deposits can be Paypal'd to us at <sales@pineappleracing.com> or you can call us with a CC number. 503-233-3878.