Megasquirt First try to start :-(
04-11-06, 05:43 PM
#1
First try to start :-(
Well I got my MS into my GXL on Sunday. I replaced my stock CAS with my spare which I`ve removed two opposing teeth on the 24 tooth wheel. I stabbed it the stock way. I have spark on the leading plugs, and the tach responds while cranking but all I managed to do was flood her out.......twice! Would someone be willing to take a look at my .msq ?
Last edited by 2713ddddavid; 04-11-06 at 05:45 PM.
04-11-06, 08:06 PM
#3
MegaSquirt Mod
you shouldn't stab it as stock, you should stab it with the third tooth after the missing tooth on the sensor, and a trigger angle of 60 degrees. I'll look at your msq later on if someone doesn't beat me to it.
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04-17-06, 07:50 PM
#8
MegaSquirt Mod
well first of all, the tach should *not* respond while cranking with the MS. That means trailing is firing for some reason....
your cranking advance angle is wrong... you have 5. With a trigger angle of 60, and a properly set up wheel decoder, cranking advance should be 0
2nd trigger should be off if you're using a CAS with teeth missing.
missing teeth should be -1
trigger settings should be 1,3 and 7,9, and you'll want to stab the CAS with the Ne sensor in line with tooth #3 after the missing tooth (to the right of the missing tooth) with the sensor facing 12 o' clock). I'm not sure the 11,1 5,7 settings will work with missing teeth.
your VE table looks ridiculously rich... which would explain the flooding if you ever got it to try to start... were you trying to build a turbo VE table? The table you generated only goes up to 100 kPa.
Cranking pulse widths look ok for an NA with stock injectors. If you have larger injectors, reduce these.
So most likely spark wasn't happening at all correctly as your wheel decoder settings were all messed up, and you're injecting too much fuel as well.
your cranking advance angle is wrong... you have 5. With a trigger angle of 60, and a properly set up wheel decoder, cranking advance should be 0
2nd trigger should be off if you're using a CAS with teeth missing.
missing teeth should be -1
trigger settings should be 1,3 and 7,9, and you'll want to stab the CAS with the Ne sensor in line with tooth #3 after the missing tooth (to the right of the missing tooth) with the sensor facing 12 o' clock). I'm not sure the 11,1 5,7 settings will work with missing teeth.
your VE table looks ridiculously rich... which would explain the flooding if you ever got it to try to start... were you trying to build a turbo VE table? The table you generated only goes up to 100 kPa.
Cranking pulse widths look ok for an NA with stock injectors. If you have larger injectors, reduce these.
So most likely spark wasn't happening at all correctly as your wheel decoder settings were all messed up, and you're injecting too much fuel as well.
04-18-06, 01:05 AM
#9
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
well first of all, the tach should *not* respond while cranking with the MS. That means trailing is firing for some reason....
your cranking advance angle is wrong... you have 5. With a trigger angle of 60, and a properly set up wheel decoder, cranking advance should be 0
2nd trigger should be off if you're using a CAS with teeth missing.
missing teeth should be -1
your cranking advance angle is wrong... you have 5. With a trigger angle of 60, and a properly set up wheel decoder, cranking advance should be 0
2nd trigger should be off if you're using a CAS with teeth missing.
missing teeth should be -1
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
trigger settings should be 1,3 and 7,9, and you'll want to stab the CAS with the Ne sensor in line with tooth #3 after the missing tooth (to the right of the missing tooth) with the sensor facing 12 o' clock). I'm not sure the 11,1 5,7 settings will work with missing teeth.
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
your VE table looks ridiculously rich... which would explain the flooding if you ever got it to try to start... were you trying to build a turbo VE table? The table you generated only goes up to 100 kPa.
I used the table generator to get what you saw. I input 1308 cc, 750 RPM idle, 135 FtLbs @ 3500 RPM, 145 HP (flywheel) @ 6500 RPM, and 7000 RPM redline.
Should I be putting differant numbers into the generater or should I not use the generator at all? the fuel tables might as well be in "Chinese". I don`t really understand what is going on there which is why I used the table generator in the first place.
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
Cranking pulse widths look ok for an NA with stock injectors. If you have larger injectors, reduce these.
)
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
So most likely spark wasn't happening at all correctly as your wheel decoder settings were all messed up, and you're injecting too much fuel as well.
I also had used easytherm since I`m using the stock sensors for coolant and MAT.
Even after burning the file from easytherm I did not see any change in the temps my MAT was showing with the stim. I did put in a 39k resistor at R4 and entered that value into the box in easytherm with the RX7 numbers that easytherm has built in. Should I be seeing lower temps after flashing with easytherm?
04-18-06, 09:14 AM
#10
MegaSquirt Mod
Originally Posted by 2713ddddavid
When you say 12 o'clock I assume you mean when standing in front of the car facing
the firewall with the firewall being 12 o'clock?
the firewall with the firewall being 12 o'clock?
I`m S4 NA so no, I`m not trying to build a turbo table.
I used the table generator to get what you saw. I input 1308 cc, 750 RPM idle, 135 FtLbs @ 3500 RPM, 145 HP (flywheel) @ 6500 RPM, and 7000 RPM redline.
Should I be putting differant numbers into the generater or should I not use the generator at all? the fuel tables might as well be in "Chinese". I don`t really understand what is going on there which is why I used the table generator in the first place.
I used the table generator to get what you saw. I input 1308 cc, 750 RPM idle, 135 FtLbs @ 3500 RPM, 145 HP (flywheel) @ 6500 RPM, and 7000 RPM redline.
Should I be putting differant numbers into the generater or should I not use the generator at all? the fuel tables might as well be in "Chinese". I don`t really understand what is going on there which is why I used the table generator in the first place.
I also had used easytherm since I`m using the stock sensors for coolant and MAT.
Even after burning the file from easytherm I did not see any change in the temps my MAT was showing with the stim. I did put in a 39k resistor at R4 and entered that value into the box in easytherm with the RX7 numbers that easytherm has built in. Should I be seeing lower temps after flashing with easytherm?
Even after burning the file from easytherm I did not see any change in the temps my MAT was showing with the stim. I did put in a 39k resistor at R4 and entered that value into the box in easytherm with the RX7 numbers that easytherm has built in. Should I be seeing lower temps after flashing with easytherm?
You should see different temps with megatune. The MS is probably getting the right temperatures, but you need to copy the generated .inc files to your MegaTune/car1 directory. That way MegaTune will also know what temps match which ADC values. (The MS doesn't report a temperature back to MegaTune, it just reports a raw ADC value, and lets MegaTune translate that to temperature).
04-18-06, 07:12 PM
#11
Ken ,
Every time I try to use the table generator I get the same very rich results. I am using cubic centimeters not cubic inches.
750 RPM Idle 20kPa.
135 Ft Lbs , 3500 RPM , 100kPa
145 Crank HP 6500 RPM, 100 kPa
7000 Redline 100 kPa
Any idea why this happens?
Every time I try to use the table generator I get the same very rich results. I am using cubic centimeters not cubic inches.
750 RPM Idle 20kPa.
135 Ft Lbs , 3500 RPM , 100kPa
145 Crank HP 6500 RPM, 100 kPa
7000 Redline 100 kPa
Any idea why this happens?
04-19-06, 10:22 AM
#16
MegaSquirt Mod
I'm not sure what you're talking about...
The AFR table shouldn't be generated... you should be doing that whole thing by hand. The ONLY thing you can generate is the VE table.
Also, if it's showing voltages, you should change your settings.ini to match the wideband O2 controller you have. If you don't have wideband, you shouldn't be using the AFR table.
The AFR table shouldn't be generated... you should be doing that whole thing by hand. The ONLY thing you can generate is the VE table.
Also, if it's showing voltages, you should change your settings.ini to match the wideband O2 controller you have. If you don't have wideband, you shouldn't be using the AFR table.
04-19-06, 12:16 PM
#18
MegaSquirt Mod
you should go to the Lamda AFR settings and turn off AFR target tables... then go to Exhaust Gas settings, and set the voltage to .5 and the sensor type to narrow-band.
Finally, make sure NARROW_BAND is set in settings.ini.
Finally, make sure NARROW_BAND is set in settings.ini.
04-19-06, 06:04 PM
#19
Well Ken I made those corrections, stabbed the modded CAS as you instructed (the third tooth AFTER the missing tooth lined up perfect with the VR sensor) Plugged in the MS and the 7 actually STARTED...... but would not stay running for more than 1 to 2 seconds. Acts like runs out of gas. Is there something I missed concerning the fuelpump??? What the hell it really started and ran smooth for a second 
04-19-06, 06:19 PM
#20
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How are you powering your fuel pump ? This happened to me when I removed the AFM and was trying to power the pump using the fuel pump relay wire on the factory harness. This will not work since once you remove the AFM the relay won't turn on the pump until the flap on the AFM is opened. Try powering your pump the test connector on the inner passenger side fender.
04-19-06, 08:12 PM
#21
MegaSquirt Mod
it could also be that you just don't have enough fuel going in. IE the ve table might be a bit lean.
An easy way to see if that's the case is to gradually increase your req_fuel until the car will stay running.
An easy way to see if that's the case is to gradually increase your req_fuel until the car will stay running.
04-19-06, 10:44 PM
#22
Originally Posted by West-se
How are you powering your fuel pump ? This happened to me when I removed the AFM and was trying to power the pump using the fuel pump relay wire on the factory harness. This will not work since once you remove the AFM the relay won't turn on the pump until the flap on the AFM is opened. Try powering your pump the test connector on the inner passenger side fender.
I`m using a "Plug n Play wiring adapter attaching the MS to my factory harness. The AFM is still in place wired stock. I did not make ANY wiring changes to the fuel pump circuit that I`m aware of. (was I supposed to alter something?) Which test connector do you mean. Can I use it to power the pump for the purpose of testing just to rule out whether the pump is being powered correctly or not. ( I know its not safe to use that as a permanent solution)
Originally Posted by muythaibxr
it could also be that you just don't have enough fuel going in. IE the ve table might be a bit lean. An easy way to see if that's the case is to gradually increase your req_fuel until the car will stay running
I used the same numbers we spoke of earlier in this post to generate the table I`m using. My table looks like the one you posted exactly. I can transform the table with its built in transform tool by "shifting" the entire table a little at a time, it looks to be fairly simple, OR would it be better to enter the changes by hand?
By the way, I`m really excited that it started.... if only for a second. This has been one of the more challenging projects I`ve ever taken on. ( yeah I`m patting myself on the back)
Last edited by 2713ddddavid; 04-19-06 at 10:48 PM.
04-19-06, 11:02 PM
#23
MegaSquirt Mod
well, the table generation tool isn't a guaruntee to a table that'll start your car.
Just keep upping req_fuel a little at a time until the car stays running.
Once you get it to stay running, you can use the "reset req_fuel" feature of the VE table editor to rescale the VE table appropriately.
Just keep upping req_fuel a little at a time until the car stays running.
Once you get it to stay running, you can use the "reset req_fuel" feature of the VE table editor to rescale the VE table appropriately.