V-Mount impressions
05-12-03, 12:44 AM
#28
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
iTrader: (2)
Thank you all for the compliments and experience sharing. When I designed it, I didn't have the girl attraction factor in mind but I guess that's the extra benefit of the v mount. hehe.
I want to point out some technical stuff on the heat soak issue.
1. Any intercooler will heat soak if you don't have any air blowing through it. How fast it recovers from heat soak depends on the effiency of the intercooler fins, intercooler surface area, and intercooler mass. Let's just say a bigger intercooler takes longer to be heat soaked but it also takes longer to cool down assuming you have the same amount of air blowing at it. vice versa.
2. The proper place to measure the heatsoak is at the pipe right after the intercooler, not on the intake manifold. If you measure it from the manifold, you are measuring heat soak of the intake manifold, not the intercooler. If you warm up your car to operating temp and then just park it there, the intake temp measured from the stock air temp sensor located under the intake manifold will go up instantly because the manifold is attached to the engine block that holds a lot of heat but the intercooler core itself should still be cool to touch. The SMIC tends to heat soak faster because the radiator fan is blowing hot air right at it and that's why it also takes longer for it to recover from heat soak.
I just got Tgriesel's (Tom's) dual probe intercooler temp gauge in and we will get some numbers on intake temps. We will put the sensor right before and right after the intercooler to take the proper reading. Tom also has the Defi Link V2 water temp, oil temp, and fuel pressure gauges coming in about 2 weeks. After all those gauges are in, we will be able to provide test data for you guys. Thanks. In the mean time, save up!
Chuck Huang
I want to point out some technical stuff on the heat soak issue.
1. Any intercooler will heat soak if you don't have any air blowing through it. How fast it recovers from heat soak depends on the effiency of the intercooler fins, intercooler surface area, and intercooler mass. Let's just say a bigger intercooler takes longer to be heat soaked but it also takes longer to cool down assuming you have the same amount of air blowing at it. vice versa.
2. The proper place to measure the heatsoak is at the pipe right after the intercooler, not on the intake manifold. If you measure it from the manifold, you are measuring heat soak of the intake manifold, not the intercooler. If you warm up your car to operating temp and then just park it there, the intake temp measured from the stock air temp sensor located under the intake manifold will go up instantly because the manifold is attached to the engine block that holds a lot of heat but the intercooler core itself should still be cool to touch. The SMIC tends to heat soak faster because the radiator fan is blowing hot air right at it and that's why it also takes longer for it to recover from heat soak.
I just got Tgriesel's (Tom's) dual probe intercooler temp gauge in and we will get some numbers on intake temps. We will put the sensor right before and right after the intercooler to take the proper reading. Tom also has the Defi Link V2 water temp, oil temp, and fuel pressure gauges coming in about 2 weeks. After all those gauges are in, we will be able to provide test data for you guys. Thanks. In the mean time, save up!
Chuck Huang
05-12-03, 05:05 AM
#31
Eats, Sleeps, Dreams Rotary
iTrader: (2)
hehe. those are the twin 25 row ones. I also have the twin 34 row oil cooler kit which is the biggest size you can fit without scraping your oil cooler on the ground. 
Originally posted by Kento
the oil coolers aren't big enough...
the oil coolers aren't big enough...
05-12-03, 06:47 AM
#33
Lives on the Forum
Chuck,
I have to admit, your V-mount IC/Rad is a sweet setup. If I were doing strictly an open-tracking FD Rx7, your V-mount IC/Rad, dual monster oil cooler setup would be the way I'd go, ESPECIALLY if I lived in the southeast, southwest, or west coast where ambient temps are consistently higher than in the midwest.
For now, my FD's pulls double duty, "streetfighter" and "track star"...thus my GReddy Type 24 V-spec FMIC and Koyo rad work well for me. Admittedly, I do love the bling factor of GReddy's FMIC core peaking through the FD's mouth...the "silver teeth" get your attention hee hee
I have to admit, your V-mount IC/Rad is a sweet setup. If I were doing strictly an open-tracking FD Rx7, your V-mount IC/Rad, dual monster oil cooler setup would be the way I'd go, ESPECIALLY if I lived in the southeast, southwest, or west coast where ambient temps are consistently higher than in the midwest.
For now, my FD's pulls double duty, "streetfighter" and "track star"...thus my GReddy Type 24 V-spec FMIC and Koyo rad work well for me. Admittedly, I do love the bling factor of GReddy's FMIC core peaking through the FD's mouth...the "silver teeth" get your attention hee hee
Last edited by SleepR1; 05-12-03 at 06:50 AM.
05-12-03, 10:06 AM
#35
Full Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: San Rafael, CA
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Tyler: It was great meeting you guys too. As soon as the guages are in I'll post some data. Also, regarding the intake, several people manning the course during my runs commented that no other car sounded like mine. Tom
05-12-03, 11:32 AM
#36
Lives on the Forum
Originally posted by Chronos
I tried to convince you Sleep! but you fell to the....DARKSIDE
I tried to convince you Sleep! but you fell to the....DARKSIDE
05-12-03, 01:18 PM
#37
bought it...damn you tom!
I simply got on the forum the other day to ask a non related ? and Tom G responded that he also lived near me and should check out his car! Needless to say, after seeing his V-mount set up from rotart extreme I was impressed and since I'm doing the major engine rebuild anyway just said what the hell and bought the whole damn set up except the mini battery kit. SO I scrapped the SR radiatior and have a newly polished PFS intercooler with duct available. Any takers let me know! PS will post pics once I get the car set up!
05-12-03, 02:28 PM
#39
I'd like more details on the complexity of this instalation. What has to be cut, or rebuilt? A/C lines? oil lines? whats involved?
Originally posted by MakoDHardie
We just finished installing this kit over the weekend. We started taking parts out Thursday night and finished it Saturday night. The only problems that slowed us down were classes, work, and a midpipe that didn't fit. We had an AC line cut and rewelded as well as a BOV flange welded to a pipe but those were completed in a single day and didn't set us back any. After installing it once, I think we could probably get it done much quicker. The only reason it wasn't completed a day sooner was probably the fact that the car went from a dp and catback as its only real mods through the full install of the v-mount, intake, GReddy elbow and BOV, midpipe, y-pipe, and PFC. Most of these bolt on parts were pretty quick to get done, but for other drivers who already have some of these mods completed, the install can be done without having to really get under the car. We also flushed out the coolant system and changed over to Evan's coolant for the new radiator. The system was very efficient and although I was driving in another car, I couldn't stand to get out and watch facial expressions as people walking by drooled over the bling factor of all the new parts(everything installed with the exception of the midpipe was polished). Special thanks to Chuck at RE and Jason at the store for they're quick responses and reliability with the troubleshooting. BTW, Chuck- I think we did figure out how to get girls in the car after we were done installing. Popping the hood on Main Street attracted ladies like diamonds and free cocktails were on the menu. Good luck to the rest of the members getting ready to install their systems. Its the best weekend project I've ever done. Don't be surprized if you wake up the next morning still smiling from the first test drive.
We just finished installing this kit over the weekend. We started taking parts out Thursday night and finished it Saturday night. The only problems that slowed us down were classes, work, and a midpipe that didn't fit. We had an AC line cut and rewelded as well as a BOV flange welded to a pipe but those were completed in a single day and didn't set us back any. After installing it once, I think we could probably get it done much quicker. The only reason it wasn't completed a day sooner was probably the fact that the car went from a dp and catback as its only real mods through the full install of the v-mount, intake, GReddy elbow and BOV, midpipe, y-pipe, and PFC. Most of these bolt on parts were pretty quick to get done, but for other drivers who already have some of these mods completed, the install can be done without having to really get under the car. We also flushed out the coolant system and changed over to Evan's coolant for the new radiator. The system was very efficient and although I was driving in another car, I couldn't stand to get out and watch facial expressions as people walking by drooled over the bling factor of all the new parts(everything installed with the exception of the midpipe was polished). Special thanks to Chuck at RE and Jason at the store for they're quick responses and reliability with the troubleshooting. BTW, Chuck- I think we did figure out how to get girls in the car after we were done installing. Popping the hood on Main Street attracted ladies like diamonds and free cocktails were on the menu. Good luck to the rest of the members getting ready to install their systems. Its the best weekend project I've ever done. Don't be surprized if you wake up the next morning still smiling from the first test drive.
05-12-03, 02:50 PM
#41
Full Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Middletown, Ohio (Cincinnati area)
Posts: 217
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Does the v-mount IC heat soak faster then just a normal SMIC. Only because it would be kinda the same of a SMIC being inside the engine bay. But sine the rad is moved how much more effiecent are they compared to M2's large IC? Do they last longer in heat soak or is it about the same?
05-12-03, 03:07 PM
#42
Full Member
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: San Rafael, CA
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ptrhahn & DadelGT: It is basically all bolt on. There is one easy cut needed on cross member that is bolted in front of the engine and if you want to retain your AC, one pipe out of the condensor needs to be cut, repositioned and rewelded, another AC pipe out of the dryer needs to be bent. Not a big deal. I had my system tested & recharged after the installation and there were no leaks or problems. Also I think it actually runs colder than it did before due to greater air exposure.
Domestic513: Read Chuck's post above regarding heat soak. In answer to your question, it takes longer to heat soak and cools faster than a SMIC due to greater air exposure and flow. Tom
Domestic513: Read Chuck's post above regarding heat soak. In answer to your question, it takes longer to heat soak and cools faster than a SMIC due to greater air exposure and flow. Tom
05-12-03, 04:04 PM
#43
Congrats man, Setup looks sweet. So far I've seen 3 V-mounts.....and all were on silver 7's Including mine. I got mine done over the weekend. Heatsoak is definatly not an issues, and temps drop very quickly as stated above. The only issues im having is with my stock coolant hoses. I think they want to be changed. Hopefully I don't lose too much coolant before I change them. Evans is expensive stuff. Well again congradulations and have fun with it. I know I can't wait to
Including mine. I got mine done over the weekend. Heatsoak is definatly not an issues, and temps drop very quickly as stated above. The only issues im having is with my stock coolant hoses. I think they want to be changed. Hopefully I don't lose too much coolant before I change them. Evans is expensive stuff. Well again congradulations and have fun with it. I know I can't wait to
05-12-03, 09:42 PM
#47
boost deprived
Join Date: May 2002
Location: sioux city, IA
Posts: 152
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by t-von
I'm curious to know how much HP the intercooler is good for? It looks a little small for really high Hp aplications. Is a larger intercooler available? Or is this design so efficiant that a larger intercooler isn't neccessary?
I'm curious to know how much HP the intercooler is good for? It looks a little small for really high Hp aplications. Is a larger intercooler available? Or is this design so efficiant that a larger intercooler isn't neccessary?
05-12-03, 09:46 PM
#49
Uber Newb.
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: LSU - Baton Rouge, Louisiana
Posts: 98
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally posted by JimmyJimboJet
Intercooler Spec: Newest tube-and-fin intercooler core, with internal fins, flows 935 CFM at 15 psi, enough to support 600HP
Intercooler Spec: Newest tube-and-fin intercooler core, with internal fins, flows 935 CFM at 15 psi, enough to support 600HP
