Hi,

I'm in the market for a new intercooler and was wondering which one you guys recommend. The Greddy SMIC or the M2 Performance SMIC? I've looked at both and it seems to me the Greddy looks like it has a better fit. I'm looking to upgrade to a M2 stage 3 level type of setup in the future. I don't do any road racing at all, just street driving. Which one would be best for me. Any info would be great, thanks.

 

The m2 is bigger but requires an aftermarket intake system. The m2 comes with the metal intercooler piping too, all you must buy is the greddy elbow. The m2 intake and intercooler are an awesome combo.

 

the GReddy SMIC doesnt look that much larger and more efficient than the stocker. a big waste of $1,100, IMO. go with the best stock mount intercooler, the M2 large.

 

Nicely said, bro.
DAN

 

m2 whoops greddy *** imho...greddy is barely bigger then stock

m2 is nicely sized has a nice duct, but requires a aftermarket intake( excuse to up grade!)

personaly if you gonna spend money do it right the first time, its alot cheaper and more gratifying to do it right once instead of haveing a poissible weakpoint in your system

 

Get the M2.....hands down. You can't even begin to compare the two. And if you plan to ever go single, go ahead and just buy the M2 large.

 

The major drawback to the M2 is that it won't fit w/ the stock Air Box and Elbow so so total cost including Intake & Greedy elbow will be over $1600 the Greedy smic can be used w/ the stock airbox & the STOCK elbow and can be purchased fo less than $1100 new and you may be able to find a used one for less than $700 While not as large as the M2 the Greedy is Much better than the Stock Unit.
SR Motorsports also makes an smic that is slightly bigger than the Greedy, will fit with the stock airbox and elbow and cost about $150 less - however it has some fitment problems w/ Radiators thicker than stock - the botom tank needs cut and rewelded to clear Mariah has done a few and I think SR will be modifying their design on future production.

 

Don't listen to these know nothings that say the GReddy is barely bigger than stock. In truth it is an excellent design and is on par with intercoolers like the PFS.

Intercooler Thickness Width Height Volume

Stock IC 2.5 11.5 4.5 129.375
M2 Medium 3.5 12.55 11.55 507
Greddy SMIC 4.0 12.5 7.5 375
PFS 3.5 10.4 10.5 382.2

This data seems to indicate that the GReddy is 2.9 times bigger than stock and the M2 is 1.35 times bigger than the GReddy but some how people here think "m2 whoops greddy *** imho...greddy is barely bigger then stock." Hmmmm, I thinks this statement is uneducated. This said, the M2 is better but it all depends on your application. I'd say that for your needs the GReddy would be fine. A couple of notes on the GReddy. The ducting for it sucks big time. However if you have any skill at all you will be able to create some of your own. It comes with all needed pipes unlike others and lets you keep the stock air box. If you have any questions beyond this feel free to check out my site or e-mail me. I'll give you straight up answers that aren't clouded with biased opinions.

 

i have the greddy smic, and i think that it is great. I havent seen the m2 smic, so i cant really compare the two, but I thought that i might defend the greddy smic cause everybodys bashing it. It is alot larger than stock - if you look at the stock ic, you will notice that over half of it's size is it's endtanks. this might make the stock ic look larger than it really is. the greddy ic is also alot thicker than stock. the quality is very nice. i've noticed air intake temps below 45C in southern california weather.

i wouldnt spend 1100 on it though. i bought mine used for $700.

besides, with intercoolers, bigger isnt always better. the larger the intercooler, the more that it will probaly reduce air flow. the ideal setup would be the best flowing ic that lowers air temps for your turbocharger. a large FMIC would be great for somebody with a large single turbo boosting 17lbs, but might reduce performance when combined with stock turbos running stock boost.

 

The numbers posted are what you want to look at. Look at the volume! The Greddy and the stock intercooler have the same at 375. Now look at the volume of the M2, more than 500! Now you tell me whats better....

 

Just look at a picture of the Greddy IC. Sure it has a core size about the size of the PFS unit, BUT LOOK AT THE BOTTOM TANK. That is the damn worst endtank design.....too much pressure loss for it to compare with the PFS unit. Before anyone starts flaming me just use some common sense. If the efini y pipe which, flow wise, moves the pipe connector somewhat out of the way of the charge air compared to the stock y pipe and its known to show almost 1 psi more boost. Now look at the greddy end tank, whats that, I its a big kink in the air flow, worse than the pipe connector on the stock y pipe, so there will be some bad pressure loss going on as the air is forced through that small endtank design. Ducting is another minus for the Greddy. I might pay $400 used for one, but now that I think about it, I'd just save my 400 until I can get a real IC design that does a better job. M2 med. does, the CWC does, PFS does, not counting the large ones.

Tim Benton

 

no look again.its' hard to read because the spacing is screwed..
volume for stock 129.375...not 375..

anyways the m2 is still better

 

Thanks for all the opinions guys. The maximum mods I'll be doing to my Rx-7 will probably be M2 stage 3 + upgraded ball bearing twin turbos. I was leaning towards the M2 medium for this setup. But the more I look at both intercoolers, it seems to me that the Greddy unit fits much nicer, not touching any other components, like the battery tray. I didn't want constant rubbing of anything under the hood. Also, the M2 looks like it sits higher than the Greddy, has anyone heard of any hood rubbing with either intercooler? I know aftermarket parts sometimes aren't perfect, I used to have a Cusco tower bar, and it rubbed the hood liner and the y pipe for some reason. Thanks for all the info guys.

 

you're gonna run M2 BB Twins with a GReddy SMIC?!?!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! ROTFLMFAO!! thats the funniest **** ive heard this year!

i hope you are joking.

 

also, you cant run the M2 Stage III in conjunction with the BB Turbos. the Stage III ECU can not handle the BB Twins. youll need to run a PFC.

spend some time doing some research before your car has to spend some time in the shop getting a new engine.

 

Hey Joe,

This guy is actually running the ball bearing twins with Stage 3 ECU with no problems.

https://www.rx7club.com/vforums/show...+bearing+twins

I don't want that much horsepower, just faster response. So that's why I was thinking the Greddy unit should be OK, I've seen many fast RX-7s use the Greddy, Tri Point ASP car and a single turbo Greddy RX-7 a while back, they both have pretty high hp output, that's why I'm comparing it with the M2. So I don't really see what is so funny about that. ??

 

yeah, thats why he's keeping it at 12 PSI. now Bill's running a PFC and 1200 cc secondaries. now he can turn up the boost and have some fun.

another thing...have you considered FMICs?? much better than SMICs, IMO.

 

A few more comments and responces. As for running the GReddy with the BB twins I see no problem with that. One of the main points of high flow turbos is to lower the temps of air, so unless you are talking a restrictive design flaw, the GReddy should have no problem cooling already cooler air right???

Also in regards to the "kink" in the lower end tank on the GReddy it is no kink at all. If you were to buy one and take a close look you would notice that the pipe going in to the tank gets flatter and wider as it enters the tank thus keeping the same area at all times. It's actually very inovative and is one of the ways GReddy was able to cram such a large core in to the stock space. I personally noticed no loss in boost when I put mine in. Only more power.

 

This table is from the Oct 99 issue of Sport Compact Car. It doesn't include the Greddy, but the results are suprising.
T = temp
MC = Mazda competition

...................stock.....MC......M2
Ambient T.......81°......88°.....65°
Turbo out T...232°....240°....220°
Intake T........165°....170°.....87°
Press loss.......2.6......2.6......1.1

Both the stock and Mazda comp have upper and lower endtanks, while M2's are on the sides.

 

I'm giving this thread a free bump since at least once a month I get 1 or 2 question about my Greddy SMIC vs. M2's SMIC.

Just ignore JoeD's responses.

 

I spoke to Brian at M2 in the past regarding his bb turbos. They were actually discouraging people from buying them because most people think you simply bolt these on and get 400 whp. First, you will need every bolt on mod, the m2 stage 3 pretty much has all that, except a midpipe, which you will need for anything over 320whp. Secondly you will need something other than the m2 stage 3 ecu i.e. PFC, Haltech, etc. Thirdly, you will need to upgrade your fule pump, and more than likely your injectors to really get your moneys worth out of the bb turbos. Also once you exceed your stock boost levels your are not going to get the maximum hp out of your mods, because once past 10 psi, you need to upgrade your ignition, i.e. HKS twin power.

Another thing that comes to mind is that if you want to run a midpipe it would be wise to port your wastegate, and a boost controller will be a must because the M2 ecu cannot compensate for a boost spike. I'm not sure what kind of hp you are looking for, but just so you know, I have the M2 stage 3 kit, and dyno'ed only 277whp. When you look at the dyno I was headed towards around 300whp, but started misfiring badly, due to having a stock ignition. I hit peak hp at 6500rpm, far from redline. I have since upgraded to the HKS Twin Power, and have noticeably more hp to redline and no more black smoke out the exhaust during wot. Once I install my ported turbos, greddy boost controller and a reso mp I'll be back to the dyno to see what numbers I pull.

One last thing, why would you mate an inferior i.c. (greddy) to an inferior intake( stock) when you could go with a true cold air intake, and the m2 med? Where's the logic in installing a lesser intercooler, only because it fits better next to a lesser intake??

I think we both had similar plans with our cars, just that I'm a few steps ahead of you. As far as the bb turbos, if you don't want to boost them to what the are capable of (17psi), then there is really no reason for you to have them. Many people have had their stock twins up to 350+whp, which is quite a bit of power for a 2800lb car. Hope this helps. BTW, check out my sig.

 

BTW, this thread sure is old!!

 

at least we know M2 wins over Greddy

 

wait.

who are u talking to?

 

ROFL pretty funny how old it is.

Kevin T. Wyum