You've added nothing with this post.

I got the idea from the story that you quoted, "Which turbo would you rather have? We would rather not have this turbo. We would have been happier putting $205 towards a quality turbo from <b>SSAutoChrome</b>, Garret, Turbonetics or even getting a used turbo."

This sentence seems to indicate that the original author was under the impression that the turbo they received was not an authentic SSAutoChrome product.

Or maybe they were saying they'd rather have put the $205 towards a more expensive ssautochrome turbo instead of the super-cheap one that is made in china. But then why would they trust a company that just tried to fool them?

Reading over the story again, this line backs up the idea that the xspower turbo reviewed is not an authentic ssautochrome turbo,

"After more research into XS POWER turbos, we found a picture from a user that had problems with their compressor housing splitting. This turbo is IDENTICAL to the turbo we received from ZY Turbo in China. This is identical to the turbo we received. Is this the 'quality' that ZY Turbo has to offer American performance enthusiasts? This is an XS Power turbo sold by SSAutoChrome on eBay. You can see that it looks like a better unit. And it's made in America!"

In fact, please post the source of the original article as I'm very interested in reading the entire story.

Actually, I wasn't saying ASP was the "absolute best". However, I was implying that more expensive intercoolers probably work better than the XS Power SMIC. And that people wanting the best performance for their cars will pay the premium for the product that will offer the best performance.

'Probably'? That's alot of dosh for a big probability.

I posted Kevin's testing method of 'the larger the intercooler the better the performance' (I don't believe it, but he's the IC god so it must be true).

He backpeddled his own wisdom on IC's when I posted how much volume the XS has. The XS IC is about 450 in volume (in x in x in). Which is bigger than the Greddy SMIC.

So just going by his previous posts on size vs efficiency (providing there is enough airflow). The XS should outpreform the Greddy.

I would rather be on the $99 side of the 'probability' than the $1500. Again, how much more efficient can the $1500 unit be? By a few precentage points only if you read the FD3S.Net postings.

That small precentage, for that huge of a cost? Come on. You're almost into single turbo price range. The difference is just TOO monumental.

Quit being such a simpleton. The quote you listed was a debate from 10 years ago focused on comparing cores from the same manufacturer, Spearco. The partial quote you listed is entirely true on the following condition, ALL ELSE BEING EQUAL. Which in case you haven't noticed isn't the case. As mentioned before the XS uses an old style core from the early 90's and with no duct to boot. So, all else is not equal.

Can we get beyond comparing the xspower ic to kevin's ic? Until somebody proves something (pro or con) about the xspower ic, its just a bunch of internet jabber.

I'm sure all else being equal a bigger ic would be more effective than a smaller ic, but nobody is claiming all else is equal. In 30 pages I think we've established at least 3 things.

1) The internal design of the xspower core is old technology
2) SSAutoChrome is an unknown and at best dubious company
3) Build quality and quality assurance probably doesn't exist - most people have been happy with the ic they received although Kevin posted pictures showing a pretty shabby looking ic
**4) Given the above, most agree that for the Casio minded of us the XS Power IC is still likely a good upgrade over stock
**5) Ducting is still an issue

I'd like to see some pics of people's ducting solution, sonix7 weren't you putting something together using the whole width of the nose?

Good summation. I'll bet it's not going to be good enough for a few though :wallbash:

THANK YOU

:)

I will be honest. The ducting is not the only thing that is a problem. I simply bought a core with endtanks for my application from them as far as I am concerned. I still think it was worth my $245.00. The piping is good but most don't want the BOV there, and they are too long. the outlet pipe to the elbow sucks for stock, and does not meet up with the greddy elbow. I found that it sits really messed up with the pipes they gave me. That is why I went a had some aluminum ones made. I still ended up ordering the air pump pipe for the ASP IC. So that was another $130. I am having a connector pipe made for the greddy elbow. I hate the logo on the top, that is coming off. I also need to create a new duct. I did make one from the stock inlet of the stock intercooler duct. I am using that as a plug for a new one out of CF. It looks like shit because its a plug, I am making a template for a mold of these. I was going to use the polystyrene foam I have, but decided I will just template off this one. I will post some pics when I get to my home cpu.

Instead of closing this thread, all future posts not directly related to the performance, quality, or installation details of the IC will be deleted. If people want to read circular arguments about the relative worth of this IC, they can read the first 24 pages of this thread....there's no point in continuing it.

Wow, I was just reading this and a whole page disapeared

Kevin, do you have the original source of the article you quoted? I'd like to read the earlier part about how they originally obtained the faulty turbo. It could shed light on the ic situation.

Thanks for leaving the thread open rynberg.

I'm haveing ducting made, most likely out of sheet metal. If theres enough interest it will be used as a template for furthur copies. PM me if you are interested. Pictures within a couple weeks.

I have one of the ebay intercoolers on one of my cars and I made all my own piping to front mount it. I looks well made and I have no complants so far.

Yeah, it was www.differentracing.com. Of all things they race Saturns :wallbash: .

I talked to the guy via email and confirmed they've never actually owned or seen in person a turbo from SS Autochrome. They just assumed it was better because it looked nice in the pictures on ebay. The article was a little confusing about if they had ever used one.

Kevin T. Wyum

Okay I got one of my mediums in finally so I could take some side by side pics. A couple things stood out to me upon doing so. I never realized how few rows the XS IC has. The other thing I didn't notice was that the cast end tanks they're using taper in way too far at the bottom. When you factor in the thickness of the casting the bottom few rows have virtually no air flow on the charge side making them useless. Someone wasn't thinking when they made that casting. People that have the older version are probably in better shape. Not sure how much they taper.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/IC1.jpg

Had to muck around with sizing the pics sorry.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/Picture 010.jpg

Some pics to show the different fin density.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/ASPIC.jpg

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/SSIC.jpg

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/ASPIC2.jpg http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/SSIC2.jpg

And finally showing thickness.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/Picture 011.jpg

That's it for now.

finally a comparo

Since I finally got a better camera here are some pics I tried to take with my POS before.

The welding pit in the IC that goes all the way through and the rust.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/Pit1.jpg http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/rustIC.jpg

Another item of interest was the material used for the charge rows on the XS. It looks like a casting or extrusion. The standard sheet aluminum charge row is shown below it.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/SSCHARGE.jpg

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/ASPCharge.jpg

Lastly just a fun shot with the new camera. A few fins of the XS.

http://www.winternet.com/~aspi/XSIC/XSfinfun.jpg

I love building custom stuff so i got the XS power IC to test and give every one fead back of my findings. As well as costs to make it perform well.

First redid the hard pipes to fit better (pore fitment with out modification) and put the larger flange on it for my greddy rs bov. I also built custom intakes for the twins to fit in the now smaller space. I custom built a duct using fiberglass Test product installed last night will post pics tonight after more testing when its warm out side. The large radiator hose was in the way and was touching the IC so i got a new flex metal one to relocate over about two inches.

I might have hooked somthing on the turbo end back up wrong (will post pics to get help or to make sure all is well in that area.)

It dosnt seem faster to me. infact it feals slower? The pipes and IC collect ass loads of heat and i mean ass loads of heat evan with the duct. so i think my power loss is from compressing hot air. my next step is to wrap the pipes and put a ultra thin pull threw fan on the back side so even at a dead stop there will be cool air passing through the intercooler.

I think i could have hooked something else up wrong. It does spool faster and is boosting to 10psi but it feals a bit slugish compared to stock. when i put the clutch in my bov goes off just fine but rite after words a secound sound much louder than my bov goes beeeoooooooooo. Any sugestions? Ideas what would make that sound? my goal is to test this intercooler and see how much it cost to get it to actualy perform.

So far money spent was
Intercoller kit $200
piping for intakes $40
fiberglass suplies $70
raidator hose $49
Greddy BOV flange $10
two matching air filters K&N $40

so far $409 dollars spent to make it work
to make it work better
Thin 12" x12"x 1.5" pull threw style silent fan $160
heat wrap $50

oh yah and the BOV was $200

great pics Jim!