Haha. Yep. That's exactly what I'm talking about. You know I've been wondering here for years why the proud owners of these cars are the most likely to say they are over-priced.

 

Checking autotrader and ebay won't tell you anything. The only way to actually know what these cars are selling for is to buy and sell them yourself or know what the actual buying and selling prices are.

Today it's really difficult to get a handle on the market because very few cars are selling.

Here's great example of a nice FD: https://www.rx7club.com/3rd-generati...ngine-1126970/

It was listed a few days ago and already has a sale pending. Who knows what the actual sale price is but even at 26.5 it's a nice FD.

Here's what appears to be nice low mileage FD but clearly 45k (current asking price) is too high or it would have sold 6 months ago. Personally I think it's a 40k fd which is a still a very good price https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...modelCode1=RX7

 

Hey, Fritz. I didn't say where I thought prices were. Let me ask something. When a car is auctioned on ebay, you see the reserve being met, and it is sold, can't you assume the last price was what it sold for? I think you can, btw, as I have sold several bikes and a few cars that way and the last price was what they sold for. Also, when I look at an FD being auctioned on ebay, I often go to the bidding list and see what was going on. I find that useful, as well as the number of bidders. Autotrader is much less helpful.

And, as I said, there has been a lot of complaining and denial for years. I'm so tired of hearing how ridiculous prices have become. How this or that one is not worth such and such a price. Prices have been going up and faster and to levels many never thought they would. The FD deserves to be a valuable collector class car.

 

Right and the last car we saw that was decent sold for 22k on ebay. The buyer didn't come through and the seller relisted at 49k LOL

We've both said for years that this car would be a collector while many laughed. Well now we are laughing at them

In your post above you made it seem as if I'm fighting the prices going higher? Anywho I think you, me and the rest of the members here believe prices will continue to move higher. That said I'm not paying 40k for an FD at this time and apparently neither is anyone else which is why there are currently more low mileage cars on the market than I have ever seen and none are selling.

Still some great cars selling for 25k and lower so why pay 40k.

 

Was this the silver with 45K? Can't recall if it was a '93 or 4.

 

Yep and it was a 93 ssm/black touring

1st listed with no reserve and sold on ebay for 22k (buyer didn't follow through)
Listed again on ebay at 49 then 45 and finally 39
Next sold on BAT for 23500 plus the 5% commission so call it 25k

I may be a little off on the numbers above but not by much. My memory is getting worse by the day LOL

The car was a bad overall example of an FD with 45k miles. Interior was sticky and scratched, It had been repainted (poorly).... likely stored for a long time without being driven etc.... or in my book it was a sub 20k FD. Someone paid too much.

 

Hey, Fritz. Didn't see this before. I truly was in no way suggesting you didn't think prices were on the rise. As you said, you and I have been saying it was going to happen for years. However, many guys here fought the increasing prices for years. Some still do.

 

Early comments in this thread didn't age well. These days, FD with close to blown apex seals goes for around 30k USD on a really really good day...

 

Agreed. Those early posts were fun to read today. Cool to see the folks who were 100% spot on back then.

 

Yeah. I was planning on getting a FD in about 5 years, but I guess the price will rise like hell... Rip my dreams I guess...

 

While FD prices are on the rise, as are so many other collectibles, and while I have always promoted that prices were going up significantly, I think we are going to see a slight backing off in prices later this year. Then, after a hiatus of some time, they could start to rise again, if the economy stays flat or gets better. I am predicting a somewhat noticeable downturn in the back half of the year continuing for some time.

 

I would welcome this—especially if it means more enthusiasts can get their hands on these incredible cars.

 

I just don't see the downturn happening. I think it will level off. At least for a good clean sub 100k mile car with light to no mods. The supply just simply isn't there and the design is proving to be timeless every year. Supply and demand we keep these rising but will level off I think in the next few years.

 

Highly unlikely that a downturn comes for the FD. Elsewhere for sure, economy will always have ups and downs. But FD supply is shrinking, and "most" people buying the good ones will continue to have funds through economic ups and downs. The average person is not spending $30k+ on a 25 year old car that has very little parts support.

I don't think it will ever hit Supra pricing, but good examples will be in the $30's and into the $40's for the foreseeable future. If you want a nice body and paint, good engine, stockish engine bay and wiring, with mileage under 100k mileage, there is no way it will dip under $30k unless you just get lucky with someone in a rush to sell or selling something they don't know much about (e.g. inheriting and then selling without doing research).

 

I am not saying that prices will fall. I am saying there should at least be a "pause" in price increases. There might be a slight and temporary reduction in prices, but that might be hard to see in the overall upward trend.

 

I think the pause has been here for 6 months or so. Otherwise we would be seeing $60k sales

 

I just hope that I get a FD at a reasonable price in 5 years... I really like the car...

 

These prices still ain't bad compared to NSX and Supra.

 

Morgan Stanley just came out with a piece on the current inflation. One of their points was that used car prices in April and May were 170% of prices last year. They attributed it perhaps to a shortage of new cars due to Pandemic supply chain issues.

 

Not sure how a Morgan Stanley article applies to a niche 25 year old collector car. Trends are both up, but the global supply chain issues (not to mention the growing impact of 7+ year loans on used cars and the subsequent roll over of debt into new purchases) likely doesn't have much impact on FD pricing. I also don't think inflation is the cause for FD pricing. Supra's and NSX didn't go from $30k to $70k a few years ago because of inflation.

 

Not sure what you mean by "trends are both up", but it may be you are saying that inflation is up and so are FD prices. Not sure. Those are, however, two facts.

However, my point about Morgan Stanley noting that used car prices were up dramatically because of lack of new car availability meant that if someone couldn't find a new car they wanted and looked at used cars, they might, in fact, look at a used FD. Maybe they wanted a Ferrari and couldn't get one? Whatever. I am not saying that is by any means the sole reason FD prices have been up so much. As you know, I have been arguing that FD prices would eventually follow the E30 M3 for a decade. I am just trying to explore whether there are other reasons for current FD pricing.

 

I guess it could play a factor. But people that can't afford a Ferrari and other high end cars have long turned to less expensive alternatives (FD, vette, etc). Correlation not causation.

 

The people buying new Civics and other basic transportation are different than the people buying leisure / collector cars like the RX-7.

Increased demand (disposable income) makes sense after the recent pandemic lockdowns and upheavals. People have realized that life is short and other factors (like electrification and self-driving cars) may be shortening the rotaries' useful/legal life on the road. Better to get ahead of that now before the laws and infrastructure change.

 

Morgan Stanley's point was that people who would otherwise have bought some new car are buying used cars, because new ones that they want are not available. They are not buying FD's, because they couldn't afford a Ferrari in the example, but because there was no Ferrari they wanted. That is causation, Colin, not correlation. Are you simply arguing the point here, because you like to argue?

 

Ive been following the current ND Miata, 2020 was an up year, but 2021 is WAY up. there are ~4 months left in 2021 production and they have already made about the same number of cars they did in 2020, which was also an up year.
or to put it another way, they made ~9300 2020's, and have hit the same number in 2021, with 4 months left to go (production ends November 1st, or thereabouts)

but demand is way up, so its actually hard to find one for sale, let alone in a color or option package you want.

Mazda had the best single month sales (in number of cars sold) ever this May. biggest year for the Mx5 since 2008 or something.