NZConvertible

Yes. Most of the restriction is in the bends, and a 2.5" bend causes less than one third of the restriction that a 2" one will at the same flow.

Josepi

Don't know if you want this arguement, but not everyone has multiple cars, and dropping your car off for some asshats to mangle isn't an option.

A bolt in kit, near what, a grand is still cheaper than most other cars. It can be installed in an afternoon with the right tools. No leaving the driveway needed. Extra cost is just offsetting inconvience in my book.

silverrotor

iTrader: (1)

d/p

silverrotor

iTrader: (1)

banzaitoyota, maybe It's just me. I'm glad my adding In didn't appear to be a smart comment. I guess after seeing this thread I'm all the more appreciative that I have this accessability. Thanks!

RETed

This is my design for a proper IC pipe and hose architecture...

one bend (90-degree typical) from turbo to IC pipe
one BUMP coupling in between
one straight coupling from IC pipe to IC - inlet
one straight coupling from IC pipe to IC - outlet
one BUMP coupling in between
one bend (90-degree typical) from IC pipe to TB adapter

You might be able to get rid of the 90-degree bends, but it's very hard to match up pipes directly to these positions unless your IC pipe position is spot on.  The 90-degree hose also gives you a little leeway for slight deviation of pipe position and more flex.

Now, WHY do you want flex in the system?
Your IC is solidly mounted, well it should be.
The engine is typically mounted on soft engine mounts.
This does not apply to solid engine mounts, but I do not advocate running solid mounts on a street vehicle anyways.
The engine rotates, the IC does not - where does all that delfection go?
Into the piping and hoses...this is the same reason why radiator hoses are long and made of rubber - for flex.
This is why I REQUIRE those bump hoses - one for each side.
If you do not use bump or flex sections, you take a chance of accelerated wear & tear on hoses and clamps.  This means you end up with more chances your hoses will pop off the pipes.


So let's check out some prices.

2" pieces:
straight sections $19 x 2
90-degree sections $35 x 2
"flex" sections $25 x 2
Prices from Baker Precision http://www.bakerprecision.com/
$38 + $70 + $50 = $158 (no shipping)

2.5" pieces:
straight sections $10 x 2
90-degree sections $61.20
bump hoses $28.00
Prices from Turbonetics http://www.turboneticsinc.com/
$20 + $122.40 + $56 = $198.40 (no shipping)

Keep in mind that these hoses are typical 1/8" wall and not recommended for exposure to oil or gasoline.  There is special fluoro lined hose which is significantly more expensive.  There is also thicker 1/4" wall "heavy duty" stuff available out there.

Yes, you can get cheaper prices, but both the above sources are typical places that most people buy these hoses from.

Come on dude, can we drop the immature swearing and try to keep this a reasonable debate?


-Ted

jon88se

check the sticky link...GReddy FMIC for $840

jacobcartmill

iTrader: (6)

ok sorry for the swearing ted, but there's the problem right there: 2 flex sections and 2 90 degrees. thats where we disagree. thats 89 dollars that could be spent elsewhere on the car. about the 90 degree bend thing, i understand that the pipes might not line up perfectly, but i think i'll try that out and have a very stiff metal pipe doing my 90* bend than some 35 dollar piece of coupling..

again, some of us are on a budget here ted. i'm not saying that the things you have listed are not worthy of going on my car or anything, just saying that some of us need to spend the extra cash on other things like tires, suspension, exhaust, EMS, whatever it may be sure it would be nice to have 200 dollars worth of IC couplings on my car, but my situation doesnt exactly call for the big "bling" perfect IC couplers when i can use a substitute that will get the job done fine for a fraction of the cost and still do it well.
now if i had a 500hp FC and had to REALLY worry about the IC couplers and hose clamps it may be a different story.

PvillKnight7

iTrader: (16)

???
Cause your in the stix. Come to Baltimore...every shop has one. What kind of exhaust shop would they be if they couldnt fabricate their own exhaust systems!

jacobcartmill

iTrader: (6)

every shop can fabricate their own exhaust systems. the device such shops use is called a "crush bender."

thanks, i'll be here all semester.

dr.jones63

Dezeret, This is what Im looking at

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eB...spagename=WDVW

Im going to his shop in La Center WA and I'll get a custom core that sits in-between the frame (28"). Also he wants to make a custom RX7 package so Im bringing him my car.

"Yes I am interested in doing an intercooler for you, I would prefer you drive the car down and we will install it right there and you drive home withan intercooler installed. I need to get a model for the FC going so I can cut you a good deal. Please call me at 503 504 2504 m-fri 7-6 and we will discuss it. My name is J.R.
Thanks
JR Perrott"

Just as soon as I get it back from Hayes that is.

NZConvertible

What you're thinking of is not a mandrel bender. Nearly all exhaust shops only have a considerably cheaper press-bend machine, because that's all they need.

razorback

http://www.roadraceengineering.com/mandrelbends.htm

http://www.promical.com/

just search google for mandrel bends.

gugge

what more problems can you get from building your own IC kit ?

Lag when to large ? etc. ?

What did they use for RaD on the greddy one ? what kind of turbo ? what kind of throttle body ? etc. Does it matter ?

/bo

silverrotor

iTrader: (1)

Coincidently, Brullen Exhaust offered to build me Intercooler piping out of a ss for a very good deal but I declined. I wasn't up for fabbing an Installation of a Porshe or Starion Intercooler. Instead, I went with the V-Spec FMIC Kit and just had them make a replica pipe (before V-Spec) for my GReddy Type-S BOV - which I am selling now.

rxcyprus7

WORD!!! HAHAHA or we can buy an S2000

dr.jones63

If your a cheap would this be cheaper ?

http://www.smcenterprises.com/

dr.jones63

http://www.geocities.com/rad87gn/tech/alcohol.html

ERAUMAZDA

I know I made a tread about why fc parts are cheap...But why cheat your self 200-300. You'll just blow your engine and screw your self in the end. People are quick to spend 1000 dollars on a stereo system and refuse to buy something to save youe engines life.

NZConvertible

That's not a valid argument. The reason IC kits are so expensive is because you're paying for the considerable design and development costs, and all the factory labour required to produce a bolt-in kit. If you have the knowledge and skills to do most of that yourself you can save a considerable amount of money without any more risk to your engine compared to a kit.

Bukwild

Also did you guys consider the costs of having some one who can weld aluminum? I have the V-spec kit installed and I have to have a BOV fitting welded to the pipe and that is going to cost atleast 50 bucks. Also you want to have someone weld a bead on the ends of the pipes or the couplers with never stay on trust me. Has anyone ever had a intercooler fitting pop off. The car dies instantly. You can make a case for building your own intercooler but you won't get the same quaility out of a intercooler of ebay. Also it depends what turbo you are running. Stock you can get away with any FMIC. Once you have a upraded setup why chance thousands of dollars on saving a couple of bucks

jon88se

Cheap parts are cheap for a reason people...you will very rarely get the deal of the century. Making your own IC kit is certainly an option and a ver cost effective one but there are drawbacks. I fabb'd my own piping at the shop for my GVR4 over the summer when I did the FMIC and it came out great but I'm noticing some of the downsides now. First of all is the finish...I'm using standard mandrel bends that we had at the shop that isn't stainless. In an effort to keep the costs down I painted the pipes with high temp engine paint rather than powder-coating or jet-hot. Fast forward a few thousand miles and the bit of piping that is exposed to salt/rocks/water under the car has developed some surface rust. It's nothing that will fall apart (it happens to exhausts all the time) but I'd like my IC pipes free of any rust so eventually they will be coated. Clamps, welds and connectors was an area I did NOT skimp in though and took full advantage of affiliation with a shop. We have a TON of quality coupler/connector material at the shop for customer projects etc... and I didn't have to pay for that. Welds were done with a TIG at the shop that I also didn't have to pay for. It all can be done without a huge expense and it will work BUT eventually you will have to do things over and that costs $ in the longrun. Unless you have access to all the right equipment and materials, a kit like the GReddy is a good value (which is why I have one in the shop waiting for my FC). Someone should jump on that $840 price, it's a good deal!!

Bukwild

"People are quick to spend 1000 dollars on a stereo system and refuse to buy something to save youe engines life."

This is the smartest comment I have ever heard on this forum

NZConvertible

I still think it's pretty dumb. So far I haven't heard anyone actually say "I spent $1000 on my stereo but I think those IC kits are too expensive". Where are these people he's talking about? He's making a connection that necessarily isn't even there.

RETed

haha, that's funny!

How about "I spent $1000 on my rims (which don't do jack for performance), but I think those IC kits are too expensive"?


-Ted

ERAUMAZDA

bud...did u read my post