what size is the right size? FMIC
10-15-05, 01:05 AM
#27
Displacement > Boost
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 3,503
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
And I haven't even got to drive the damn thing yet, woe unto the megasquirt building tinkerers like myself when the car is sitting in a pile of dust ready to fire up, but no ECU. 
I think my experiences with a stock TII and a 350hp Kenworth turbodiesel dump truck have given me a bad taste for turbo. That and how damn insane my NA was before I tore it down, talk about damn near having an orgasm when slamming backroads!
I think my experiences with a stock TII and a 350hp Kenworth turbodiesel dump truck have given me a bad taste for turbo. That and how damn insane my NA was before I tore it down, talk about damn near having an orgasm when slamming backroads!
10-15-05, 02:15 AM
#28
Lives on the Forum
Originally Posted by 88IntegraLS
This sucks. There is a field in engineering called thermodynamics which is very useful for sizing an intercooler. Generally, the smaller the better for the same heat removal (less compressed volume and generally less static pressure drop with a smaller core, all else being equal). I haven't taken this class yet, it is pretty hard stuff, like senior level undergrad mechanical engineering with a lot of fuzzy math.
You need to know fluid dynamics and metallurgy from ME / CE.
Heat transfer and (black body) energy radiation can be learned from physics.
You're looking at only the inside dynamics of the intercooler, but the stuff that happens outside the IC (core) is also very important.
That's actually the tricky part, since ambient air flow is constantly changing - this is not a static equation problem.
So, you assumption about "smaller the better..." is not necessarily application in this case.
In fact, Turbonetics argues against you - they claim more mass is better.
-Ted
10-15-05, 02:18 AM
#29
Displacement > Boost
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 3,503
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Good point, I also have no experience with intercoolers and my own choice for my project was definately oversize.
Less is more dammit, my POS gutted FC wouldn't want it any other way!
Less is more dammit, my POS gutted FC wouldn't want it any other way!
10-15-05, 08:49 AM
#30
Originally Posted by Impreza2RX7
Well, your wife is going to be even more pissed when you cheaply modify your car and need a rebuilt engine. 
j/k
Dont listen to Mark (Skir) he thinks he can run a T-78 on a RTEK!
j/kDont listen to Mark (Skir) he thinks he can run a T-78 on a RTEK!
11-07-05, 02:53 PM
#32
I have injector envy!
Originally Posted by RETed
It's a lot more involved than that...
You need to know fluid dynamics and metallurgy from ME / CE.
Heat transfer and (black body) energy radiation can be learned from physics.
You're looking at only the inside dynamics of the intercooler, but the stuff that happens outside the IC (core) is also very important.
That's actually the tricky part, since ambient air flow is constantly changing - this is not a static equation problem.
So, you assumption about "smaller the better..." is not necessarily application in this case.
In fact, Turbonetics argues against you - they claim more mass is better.
-Ted
You need to know fluid dynamics and metallurgy from ME / CE.
Heat transfer and (black body) energy radiation can be learned from physics.
You're looking at only the inside dynamics of the intercooler, but the stuff that happens outside the IC (core) is also very important.
That's actually the tricky part, since ambient air flow is constantly changing - this is not a static equation problem.
So, you assumption about "smaller the better..." is not necessarily application in this case.
In fact, Turbonetics argues against you - they claim more mass is better.
-Ted
So the whole point is what are you talking about? Fluid dynamics? Where does incompressable fluids become relative in this equation. And metulurgy.......yes there is heat transfer involved but you simply find the entropy and elthaply values of a particular material....alluminum (duh) and then try to get the largest surface area to cool within reason. Too big and there is pressure drop....too small.. inefficient, but It isnt rocket science its a glorified radiator, and I preffer to be safe on my estimates, so I dont bust out all of my tech books and spend 2 days calculating the perfect IC they dont make, I work 4 hours and go buy one.
And I have no clue if this post is old but it pissed me off, because I am making a FMIC right now with rear exiting end tanks so I can run shorter pipes with less couplings and not have to notch my bumper for the pipes.
But maybe I should look into Fluid hydrodynamics black booty magic or what ever you called it.
Oh and if we are throwing out big words order your FMIC with a greddy flux capacitor..........so JDM
11-07-05, 03:03 PM
#33
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: poconos pa
Posts: 573
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
lol i forgot about this thread! i am sticking with my tmic for now since for the time being i am going to run 10 psi! i am sure it can handle it! i have done a ton of research and found out tons of information on intercoolers and for the time being i am going to stick with the tmic and i am going to invest in the greedy kit i got 400 saved away from the wife so don't tell her.sssssssshhhhhhhhhhhhh...lol thanks for all the info and i have learned to just ignore Ted's comments he means well just a bit rude! thats what happens when you have a small island to run around on got nothing but time to insalt people online!
11-07-05, 07:41 PM
#34
Lives on the Forum
Originally Posted by yusoslo
Ok Ted you have been pissing me off. I know I have a BE in Mechanical Engineering and a minor in math and physics. And I make so much money I can buy all of the greddy intercoolers. So quit being a know it all and crack on people. I spent 10 hours on sat. CNC'ing custom parts not to save money but because I like being unique.
I've been reading your thread and your replies, and I think you're a fricken' moron.
Yeah, you might have the degree, but you definitely don't know FC's, and I peg you as lacking-common-sense.
A college degree does not automatically mean you have common sense - think about it.
So the whole point is what are you talking about? Fluid dynamics? Where does incompressable fluids become relative in this equation. And metulurgy.......yes there is heat transfer involved but you simply find the entropy and elthaply values of a particular material....alluminum (duh) and then try to get the largest surface area to cool within reason. Too big and there is pressure drop....too small.. inefficient, but It isnt rocket science its a glorified radiator, and I preffer to be safe on my estimates, so I dont bust out all of my tech books and spend 2 days calculating the perfect IC they dont make, I work 4 hours and go buy one.
If you have the knowledge to PROPERLY design an intercooler, then go for it.
Most people on here DON'T.
My point was...to make it very simple FOR MOST PEOPLE is to just get the biggest thing that'll fit - sans stock turbo.
But, since you don't have much common sense, you're excused.
And I have no clue if this post is old but it pissed me off, because I am making a FMIC right now with rear exiting end tanks so I can run shorter pipes with less couplings and not have to notch my bumper for the pipes.
Since you like to brag about your college degree, I'm sure you can figure this out for yourself.
Now don't make me call you "stupid"...
But maybe I should look into Fluid hydrodynamics black booty magic or what ever you called it.
Oh and if we are throwing out big words order your FMIC with a greddy flux capacitor..........so JDM
Oh and if we are throwing out big words order your FMIC with a greddy flux capacitor..........so JDM
BTW, I'd suggest you change your nick, cause "yusoslo" makes you sound like some 15-year old punk kid with an attitude.
Change that.
You're a 20-something with the attitude of a 15-year old punk kid.
Much better?
Yeah, you're right.
I admit, I like JDM.
But...the reason why I chase HKS 46mm warning gauges on eBay is not just because HKS never brought them into the U.S. for consumption, it's just that Autometer crap was never something I ever liked in the first place.
If that make me JDM, then so be it.
So do I call your "redneck" too?
-Ted
11-07-05, 09:07 PM
#35
I have injector envy!
Let me stretch first........
To get things straight I like being a smart *** but make it no point to call someones names, I simply stated you where an irritation to me.
Second, I love HKS, thats why I have every one of their guages and available suspension products....love 'em.
Common sense....yes I have been told I lack that it....High IQ different story.
I just built a Peripherally ported second gen motor, so I take strong offense to the lack of FC or any rx-7 knowledge. Once again I did not put you down.
I saw where you where trying to go with the overall flow thing, but you cannot relate compressible and non-compressible materials.
I am done with this internet pissing contest I am going to get some sleep. When I update my website I will post up some track times to let my rx-7 knowledge do the talking and we can go from there, besides that, it's just a bunch of key punching on your moms computer.
See put downs suck dont they, and ya dont even know me, but if you see a european imported s4 on the highway then you will know me, and my degree and my wallet. later.
One more thing, my SN yusoslo is supposed to be fun, thats whay cars are, a detterent from everyday life, to get away
FC's rock.....Hawaii ehhhh not so much
To get things straight I like being a smart *** but make it no point to call someones names, I simply stated you where an irritation to me.
Second, I love HKS, thats why I have every one of their guages and available suspension products....love 'em.
Common sense....yes I have been told I lack that it....High IQ different story.
I just built a Peripherally ported second gen motor, so I take strong offense to the lack of FC or any rx-7 knowledge. Once again I did not put you down.
I saw where you where trying to go with the overall flow thing, but you cannot relate compressible and non-compressible materials.
I am done with this internet pissing contest I am going to get some sleep. When I update my website I will post up some track times to let my rx-7 knowledge do the talking and we can go from there, besides that, it's just a bunch of key punching on your moms computer.
See put downs suck dont they, and ya dont even know me, but if you see a european imported s4 on the highway then you will know me, and my degree and my wallet. later.
One more thing, my SN yusoslo is supposed to be fun, thats whay cars are, a detterent from everyday life, to get away
FC's rock.....Hawaii ehhhh not so much
Last edited by yusoslo; 11-07-05 at 09:11 PM.
11-07-05, 10:57 PM
#37
Let's steer this back on topic because I've been screwing around with this problem for a long time. Apparently I'm the only guy that wants his fog lights and A/C and P/S to still work after putting on a big turbo. The only way to keep all that is by going custom, I think all the current kits suck for fitment on FC's. Didn't Greddy or someone come out with a kit a long time ago that puts the hot and cold lines on the same side and fits between the frame rails?
11-08-05, 12:09 AM
#38
Displacement > Boost
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 3,503
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's always something called empirical data, ie. measured pressure and temperature drop for a given intercooler brand / size / tank configuration given set of input conditions.
Problem is, RX7 builders don't take this kind of data very often, if the car meets performance goals they drive it and smile.
Problem is, RX7 builders don't take this kind of data very often, if the car meets performance goals they drive it and smile.
11-08-05, 12:46 AM
#39
Needs more Displacement.
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Louisville, Ky
Posts: 1,329
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This is the most hate I've ever seen in one thread. And I've seen some hate. If I was going to go FMIC I would get the Greddy Kit for my 7 just because I don't want to have to take the time to do all the mathematical equations and whatever you all are talking about (I'm a dumbass). EASY ROUTE! Buy the **** premade! W00t! But I don't plan on getting a FMIC because all I need is about 240hp and I can get that with the stock TMIC with very little lag. YaY!
11-08-05, 07:44 AM
#40
I have injector envy!
the greddy kit is a safe bet, because it has been proven to work. A couple of guys on here who have run narrower fmic have mentioned problems of the end tanks blocking flow to the radiatior. I have finally decided on the size of my intercooler, which is the same width of the greddy, but a 1/2" thicker core, and about 2" shorter, that way it doesnt protrude as far down for better ground clearance at the track, and it isnt narrow enough to block the air flow to the rad. There where always be debate, but I can say one thing I have never heard a bad comment about the greddy, and I know it can be pricey, so The best bet is a used fmic from someone who popped their engine.
I do have to appologize for my ranting I was at home off of work due to being sick and I was in one hell of a mood
I do have to appologize for my ranting I was at home off of work due to being sick and I was in one hell of a mood
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
