Trans whine?
04-29-05, 10:22 AM
#26
andrew
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it is the throw out bearing read the haynes manuel read anything. when your foot is not on the clutch and there is noise from the tranny the throwout is the only thing it could be, but like he said do an entire clutch job tranny and all.
04-29-05, 10:46 AM
#28
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Originally Posted by JRS
alright Im confused now, which is it bc it only does it with the car in neutral and my foot off the clutch?
I'm similarly confused. This is exactly how mine happens. If this is indeed the input shaft bearing, how hard is it to replace that?
And I agree about the throwout replacement, it is so quick and easy that you should just replace it if you are in there anyway.
04-29-05, 03:46 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by aznpoopy
if clutch pedal in -> clutch disk released -> noise = throwout bearing
I do agree that they should both be replaced if you got it all out anyway.
04-29-05, 11:15 PM
#30
strike up the paean
When the driver steps on the clutch pedal, the throw-out bearing applies force to the fingers of the spinning pressure plate to release the clutch. When the clutch pedal is released, the bearing sits idle and does not contact the pressure plate fingers.
The classic symptom of a worn throw-out bearing is a whirring or growling sound when applying the clutch pedal, which goes away when releasing the pedal. Premature wear of the throw-out bearing can occur when there is insufficient clutch play, resulting in a throw-out bearing that spins continuously. If the bearing fails, it may seize and quickly wear the fingers of the pressure plate. The throw-out bearing does not require routine maintenance, but should be replaced when clutch replacement becomes necessary.
think about it... if the release bearing is only used to release a non spinning disk... it wouldn't need to be a bearing.
Last edited by aznpoopy; 04-29-05 at 11:24 PM.
04-30-05, 04:09 PM
#31
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I dont even need to read more than the first 3 posts to pinpoint this one...
Pilot bearing or input shaft bearing.
It wont be your throwout bearing as it's only engaged when you push the clutch pedal in.
Pilot bearing or input shaft bearing.
It wont be your throwout bearing as it's only engaged when you push the clutch pedal in.
04-30-05, 06:27 PM
#33
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I'm trying to get my web space set up so I can load up some pictures. It seems that there is alot of contradictory information being posted on this thread, mine and others.
04-30-05, 06:46 PM
#34
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It's simple really, but you have to know how a clutch system actually works, and thats where some of the misinformation comes from...
The throw out bearing is not engaged if the clutch pedal is not bieng pushed. It's as simple as that.
When you push the clutch pedal down, the throwout bearing puts pressure on the pressure plate teeth which in turn releases pressure off the clutch disc which slips against the flywheel connected to the engine.
It may not make sense that pushing on it releases it, you have to actually see a clutch taken apart to understand, just trust that its how it works.
The pilot bearing is inside the engine. The end of the output shaft of the transmission is actually long enough that part of it goes into the back of the crankshaft. It is supported by a bearing that we call the pilot bearing. If this is bad, it will of course cause noise.
The output shaft bearing is inside the transmission itself. It's the main bearing that supports the force of the engine applying power to the transmission. This bad could also cause your noise.
The throw out bearing is not engaged if the clutch pedal is not bieng pushed. It's as simple as that.
When you push the clutch pedal down, the throwout bearing puts pressure on the pressure plate teeth which in turn releases pressure off the clutch disc which slips against the flywheel connected to the engine.
It may not make sense that pushing on it releases it, you have to actually see a clutch taken apart to understand, just trust that its how it works.
The pilot bearing is inside the engine. The end of the output shaft of the transmission is actually long enough that part of it goes into the back of the crankshaft. It is supported by a bearing that we call the pilot bearing. If this is bad, it will of course cause noise.
The output shaft bearing is inside the transmission itself. It's the main bearing that supports the force of the engine applying power to the transmission. This bad could also cause your noise.
04-30-05, 07:33 PM
#35
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dynomite! got it to work.
Ok, so since the pressure plate is bolted to the flywheel, whenever you press the clutch pedal in, the release bearing will contact the (spinning with the flywheel) diaphram pressure fingers.
But my last question remains. Do the FC's have an auto-adjusting mechanism that would make it so the release bearing would always contact the the diaphram fingers?
This seems to contradict 3 sources that I've cited before, apologies to aznpoopy and SAiamNE if this pans out into their previous arguments.
Last edited by Needa13b; 04-30-05 at 07:45 PM.
04-30-05, 07:55 PM
#36
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Man wtf is with this thread... bunch of behind-the-screen mechanics.
aznpoopy sounds like he knows whats going on, it doesn't REALLY matter what is causing the noise unless you DON'T plan on fixing it... because if you're going to replace ANY of the things that cause a tranny whine, you SHOULD just replace them ALL... unless you're stupid?
Pilot bearing is in the e-shaft, you have to use pullers to get it out and something to press it in... a clutch alignment tool kinda works.
Release bearing is easy... really easy. If you get the tranny off and can't figure it out... step away from the car, call AAA and tell them you need to tow a car...sign the title over to me and never think about it again.
Anything else I would personally suggest buying a used tranny, it is possible the whine are worn synchros, gears, basically stuff inside the tranny that is not easy to get to.
And in Solo2's nice little writeup he forgot to mention that you need to drain your tranny of fluid before pulling it unless you have an extra driveshaft yoke lying around... like we all do. So that adds about 50$ of cost to the job (if you use redline like you should!). Also you don't need anything to support the engine... that's an FB thing, 2nd gens have the motor mounts in the center of the engine and the engine will balance on them fine without any help from a 2x4... which doesn't sound very tempting if you have undented fenders (not a problem for me! haha)
Okay I'm tired now.
--Gary
aznpoopy sounds like he knows whats going on, it doesn't REALLY matter what is causing the noise unless you DON'T plan on fixing it... because if you're going to replace ANY of the things that cause a tranny whine, you SHOULD just replace them ALL... unless you're stupid?
Pilot bearing is in the e-shaft, you have to use pullers to get it out and something to press it in... a clutch alignment tool kinda works.
Release bearing is easy... really easy. If you get the tranny off and can't figure it out... step away from the car, call AAA and tell them you need to tow a car...sign the title over to me and never think about it again.
Anything else I would personally suggest buying a used tranny, it is possible the whine are worn synchros, gears, basically stuff inside the tranny that is not easy to get to.
And in Solo2's nice little writeup he forgot to mention that you need to drain your tranny of fluid before pulling it unless you have an extra driveshaft yoke lying around... like we all do. So that adds about 50$ of cost to the job (if you use redline like you should!). Also you don't need anything to support the engine... that's an FB thing, 2nd gens have the motor mounts in the center of the engine and the engine will balance on them fine without any help from a 2x4... which doesn't sound very tempting if you have undented fenders (not a problem for me! haha)
Okay I'm tired now.
--Gary
04-30-05, 08:05 PM
#38
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nope, if the throwout bearing was always in contact they would wear out real fast.
when people "ride the clutch" by always pressing on the pedal its constantly engaging the throwout bearing and thats why their clutches go out after 5000 miles.
when people "ride the clutch" by always pressing on the pedal its constantly engaging the throwout bearing and thats why their clutches go out after 5000 miles.
05-02-05, 08:18 AM
#41
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RPM drop?
I noticed this morning that when I release the pedal, the RPM's are affected and drop slightly. I don't understand how having the car in neutral and releasing the clutch pedal would then cause the RPM's to drop.
Does that change the diagnosis?
Again, no one answered about how easy it is to change the input shaft bearing. And where is that SOB? Is it in the trans or on/near the pilot bearing?
Does that change the diagnosis?
Again, no one answered about how easy it is to change the input shaft bearing. And where is that SOB? Is it in the trans or on/near the pilot bearing?
05-02-05, 11:52 AM
#42
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Originally Posted by Solo2
I noticed this morning that when I release the pedal, the RPM's are affected and drop slightly. I don't understand how having the car in neutral and releasing the clutch pedal would then cause the RPM's to drop.
Does that change the diagnosis?
Again, no one answered about how easy it is to change the input shaft bearing. And where is that SOB? Is it in the trans or on/near the pilot bearing?
Does that change the diagnosis?
Again, no one answered about how easy it is to change the input shaft bearing. And where is that SOB? Is it in the trans or on/near the pilot bearing?
*Sigh* You're engaging the clutch to the flywheel which is spinning, which connects the idler gear in the transmission to the engine when it used to be stationary... yes it will cause rpms to drop.
There is no difference between "input shaft bearing" and "pilot bearing" they're the same thing... which I think several people said already.
--Gary
05-02-05, 04:28 PM
#45
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To me, it wasn't obvious. Blame it on my lack of mechanical knowledge. But the posts above, as I go back and read them, talked about all three things (pilot, input shaft, and throwout). The step 1-3 post, for example, mentioned all three. How would I know that two are the same thing? Another said "input shaft or pilot bearing." Ok, which is it? Oh, you mean that's the same thing with two different names..... oopsie, didn't read it that way.
Not everyone was born with a wrench in their hand. Some of us are just learning how to wrench.
Anyway, thanks for the answer, now I know.
Not everyone was born with a wrench in their hand. Some of us are just learning how to wrench.
Anyway, thanks for the answer, now I know.
05-02-05, 05:35 PM
#47
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Starting to feel like Marvin here, sighing every time I read a post in this thread heh.
JRS: It doesn't really matter, the only reason you want to diagnose whether it's a release or a throwout bearing is to decide whether or not it's important to change it right away or not. The input/needle/pilot/front bearing (All those refer to the same bearing... people are just fucktards and can't use one damn name) holds the input shaft, the part coming from the transmission, up inside the e-shaft of the engine. The release bearing pushes on the pressure plate to release the clutch disc from the flywheel.
If you're replacing one, replace both... that's a total of like 10$ in parts... not worth the chance of getting everything back together and 1k miles later having the other bearing fail.
--Gary
JRS: It doesn't really matter, the only reason you want to diagnose whether it's a release or a throwout bearing is to decide whether or not it's important to change it right away or not. The input/needle/pilot/front bearing (All those refer to the same bearing... people are just fucktards and can't use one damn name) holds the input shaft, the part coming from the transmission, up inside the e-shaft of the engine. The release bearing pushes on the pressure plate to release the clutch disc from the flywheel.
If you're replacing one, replace both... that's a total of like 10$ in parts... not worth the chance of getting everything back together and 1k miles later having the other bearing fail.
--Gary
06-28-05, 05:37 PM
#48
I think I'm addicted
since i am having a big problem with this and i am planning to fix this crappy whine...
here, very good explanation
http://www.mazdatrix.com/g2.htm
here, very good explanation
http://www.mazdatrix.com/g2.htm
07-08-05, 04:27 PM
#49
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I'm having a similar clutch/noise problem
My car was parked for a year because of a leaking water pump. I had that replaced yesterday. When driving it back from the mechanic I noticed a bit of a whine when changing gears (releasing clutch). After driving it around for a while, I came to a stop and it would NOT go into gear. I tried pumping the clutch but that didn't help, so I finally put it in reverse and it made a loud clunking noise in response (different from gear grinding). Then I could get it into 1st, but the clutch noise was much louder.
When releasing the clutch pedal and pushing the accelerator in gear (to move from stop) it sounds awful, like a metallic scraping. The noise continues until the foot is off the clutch and the car is moving. Sound returns when releasing clutch when shifting up, but it is worst when moving from a standstill.
It idles fine in neutral, and when the engine is off I can change gears noiselessly and easily. But when the engine is on it can be difficult to get into any gear.
Sound like a bad pilot bearing? Or something else altogether...
When releasing the clutch pedal and pushing the accelerator in gear (to move from stop) it sounds awful, like a metallic scraping. The noise continues until the foot is off the clutch and the car is moving. Sound returns when releasing clutch when shifting up, but it is worst when moving from a standstill.
It idles fine in neutral, and when the engine is off I can change gears noiselessly and easily. But when the engine is on it can be difficult to get into any gear.
Sound like a bad pilot bearing? Or something else altogether...
07-08-05, 04:34 PM
#50
strike up the paean
zandrame
should've just made a new thread to ask
but here goes
the hard/impossible shifting + pumping pedal ->
it sounds like your clutch hydraulics are going
the bad noise when pressing on the clutch pedal and releasing clutch ->
classic throw out bearing noise
you can even feel the vibrations through the pedal and shifter, no?
metal on metal grinding
should've just made a new thread to ask
but here goes
the hard/impossible shifting + pumping pedal ->
it sounds like your clutch hydraulics are going
the bad noise when pressing on the clutch pedal and releasing clutch ->
classic throw out bearing noise
you can even feel the vibrations through the pedal and shifter, no?
metal on metal grinding
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