reatrdedspleen

This is very true. very rarely are you going to be drifting in the mid/top of 3rd. And its really only then that you need more power. At that speed its pretty easy to fient your car into a drift, or shift lock.

I dont know many people ever shifting into 4th mid drift, thats some crazy speed into a drift if you are. And If you are drifting at that speed, chances are your a pretty damn good drifter. and are aproaching drift kings skill

A better mod than a SC (for right now atleast) would be maybe a lightwieght flywheel, a better clutch, suspension, and a good working LSD.

Rotary?Cool

Wouldn't the DTSS removal be the first mod for anyone looking to drift?

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

dtss is a great mod for the fc when it comes to a drift setup. i am going to reitterate what has already been said. you dont need horsepower to drift. even with 4th gear drifts.. thats 100+mph and you have pleanty of momentum to clear any corner at that speed. best improvement for drifting is suspension and lsd. my 130hp 240sx drifts a million times better than my friends 350hp fd. all about technique and seat time. so many people think drifting is understeer when you are going around a corner. ill post a few clips of a low power s13 if you guys want but im not here to brag

RETed

Some of these comments have me laughing on the ground...

Sure, you can take a low-powered vehicle (i.e. AE-86 or S13) and drift it...at low speed.
Can you take the same car and drift a huge constant radius turn - think Irwindale initial entry?
No.

It takes torque to keep the momentum of the car moving.

You can't compare an S13 to an FD, even though the FD has way more power.
If you have tried to drift and FD, it's even much worse to keep the tail out on such a chassis.
Almost any newb can get into an S13 and pick up drifiting (with the stock KA24 motor) in a matter of minutes - this is the advantage of the Nissan S-chassis.
It takes a considerable more amount of driving skill to do the same with an FD - ask any of the FD drifters who ARE trying.

Take that 100hp AE86 or that 130hp S13 and put them in a real drift competition...
You think either would have a chance at winning?
Only if the other competitors can't drive for ****...


-Ted

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

HAHA oh my god ted... You are aware of a D1 driver named ueo right? a 190hp 86 spanking everyone. and last year there was a 140hp 86 tha qualified and took 3rd over all at a D1 event. american drifting is all about big hp but most of the skilled drivers in D1 have less than 350 hp. we have a corner here that has an entry speed of around 90 and the under powered sohc s13 has no problem with keeping angle around it. granted it is easier when you have 500hp and just power over but thats no fun and not as skillful. but back on topic. i like the turbo better than the supercharger but i think most of it is preference. just have to get used to your machine and you can drive it to its limit. one way or the other isnt going to make you a better driver

lupin

iTrader: (3)

I hear that using a steel flywheel is better for turning, I will see if I can find the article.

And Reted
Taka Aono drives a ae86 and he went 7(or 9 I forget) runs in a row with a viper and the 86 lost because it overheated.

VashtheStampede

im terribly sorry. if you hover over the first image you will see the tooltip describes the image as a supercharged dyno run and the second image as a turbo equipped car. further, it should be obvious enough from my initial posting as to supercharged versions having a more linear torque curve and turbo's being steep. interpreting the images shouldnt be too difficult as one is fairly flat and the other has quite the rise at higher rpm's. The link i included which is for the page I sourced the images from includes full descriptions of the vehicles and their setups when the dyno graphs were taken. they are the top two on that page. Im sorry though you really are right, i should have described the pictures a little better.

now to explain my position a little better: while I in general adore turbos and would never think of supercharging my car, the question as posted was "which would be better for a drift car" my answer was based on the following premise which may or may not be correct: when into a drift you will not be at full throttle. in order to properly control a slide you have to modulate the throttle to adjust for reducing speed, decreasing radius of corner, blah blah..... only in a case where the car is completely underpowered and the corner is large or your tire compound is oversoft would you really be full throttle. the nature of the turbo means that available power is not necessarily directly linked to engine rpm. in a situation where control is easily lost with a little too much wheel spin, being able to confidently apply a little throttle without wondering how much boost you're gonna get , i think, somewhat important.

so anyways. I will just go ahead and concede because at this point its not worth arguing anymore.

RETed

Wow, I didn't know 100hp = 190hp.
Yeah, you're right...it is funny!


-Ted

RETed

Last time I heard he was using a 4AGE-20V, and it was making a more than 100hp...


-Ted

RETed

I'm going to go dig into the website cause you posted it.
The replies are already ridiculous as it is.

It depends what you call "modulate".
If you can, try and check out any of the "pro" drift videos and listen to the commentators about throttle control.
You'd be surprised what the judges are looking for.


-Ted

Alak

iTrader: (9)

I can sense this thread being dragged out for a loooooong time.



Anyone here accually competition drift, just out of curiosity?

ch0g0nda

e-Drifting rules mang...

RETed

Doh!
It was supposed to say "I'm *NOT* going..."
Too late to edit! :P


-Ted

VashtheStampede

hahaha =) hate it when that happens

ProjectR13B

iTrader: (1)

so right now my drifts are usually start in 3rd, drop to 2nd. running around 35mph at most. i already have alot of plans for suspension because i already know thats important for drifting, i was just wondering how a SC worked for drifting. i know how turbos work, i know i dont need alot of horsepower.

also, i live in VA. we have no drift events. none. 0. if there were it would be helpful and i would go to some. all i have to learn from though is videos and competitions ive managed to get my hands on, and half of my videos are in japanese with no subtitles.

ProjectR13B

iTrader: (1)

back to my original question aswell, i was never asking about pro drifters, i was asking opinions on superchargers for drifting, and have recieve only a handful of opinions. mainly the responses are about drifting in drift events, and how more power wont make me a better driver. that was not what i was looking for.

classicauto

iTrader: (3)

^^^your answer is this^^^

having either one will not make or break the build

which ever one you go with you will need to become accustomed to drivng them with their quirks respectively.

As far as which one is "better" - look at the cars in pro drift events and you will see mostly turbos (I say mostly because Ive yet to see many s/c'd drift cars [and haven't seen one in D1] - but I bet theres gotta be one) That would indicate that the larger efficiency of the turbo over the supercharger is the more desirable attribute as opposed to spool time

On a sidenote - spool time really is a B/S argument, REAL tuning and turbo sizing can make it almost non-existent......

Whizbang

the good lysholm SC can be similiar to a turbosetup but they arent cheap. but one thing is that you can run a higher rear gear than you would want if you had a turbocharger.

stevensimon

iTrader: (11)

i was off... its 180hp not 190. http://www.superstreetonline.com/fea...130_0312_ae86/

still a lot less than the 350hp+ required to drift according to you.

ch0g0nda

You guys are all wrong! It takes 10,000hp+ and big azz decals to go sideways mang! GOTTA GIVER ONE HANDED!!!!

fcdrifter13

Yes way to bring in the ricer mag. Now I am going to tell you this. So listen up. Ueo GTS makes between 320-425hp depending on what set-up he uses. This whole I got low HP and can hang with the big dogs is just a ploy to make the whole American drifting thing seem more exciting.

Now I am going to list the ways you can tell from you Lazy Boy watching G4 when that **** comes on. The AE86 will not, and I dont care what you say, will never ever keep up with a GTO or Viper from a dead stop if it only has 100-190HP. Also the acceleration coming out of the drift is that of the GTO and Viper who are tuned(GTOs case) 570Hp. Man I sure wish I had a Corolla that would do that stock. Id love it like a fat kid loves cake.

Also what Ted said is true. On a long sweeper the car would start to lose momentum and slow down, gotta go fast to go sideways for a long time.



Now back to the original question. On the SC systems I have seen. They suck for the price. You could turbo an NA and get more power for probably the same amount of money. I personally like small turbo car(seeing how its the only kind ive driven) when drifting over a SC set-up. But thats just me. And from what I am told Im not exactly the sharpest tool in the shed.

RETed

So you're telling me you can drift an AE86 with just 180hp???

DUDE, have you even OWNED an AE86?
Just for the record, I HAVE.
It's a PIECE OF ****.
So you can stop the InitialD worship and get back to reality.


-Ted

ProjectR13B

iTrader: (1)

ok, ive never owned one, but i do know they are good drift cars and even with 180 hp they are still light as hell, somewhere between 2100 and 2300 lbs. with the right tuning, and a good driver, you can keep an 86 sideways for day.

ch0g0nda

I don't know why you kept typing after you got done with "I've never owned one." The AE86 is an underpowered pos. The only way to make that car competitive (all drivers being equal) is to give it 185's and put it on a wet track.

Sorry but when the dorikin said "you don't need power to drift," he was right - kinda. To get a car around small corners at low-mid speeds you don't need much in the way of power. To really be competitive you need it in droves.

Saying D1 drivers getting around in tiny engined Corollas can whoop 450hp+ Sylvias is absurd. As long as we're assuming all the drivers are roughly equal there's no way a 180hp Corolla is going to be able to keep up with a 450hp S15...

Well wait, there actually was apparantly. In '03 (I think?) at some D1 event Ueo and *** were locked in combat round after round.

Anyway, 450hp+, yeah.

ShadowX

Actually, ProjectR13B, there's plenty of events in VA, you're just not looking hard enough. Last year there was pretty much an event at least once a month.

http://www.dgtrials.com/events.php

And check out Richmond International Raceway, if I remember that's where all the events were.

And if you haven't personally drifted a car for real, save your theories and hypotheses, you really don't know.