turbine

iTrader: (1)

88 rx7 t2
i had a company who i will not name at this time rebuild an s4 turbo engine for me. i also had them dowel and balance the motor.

the engine has been running fine with 100lbs of oil pressure cold, 75lbs when warm and 100lbs when you rev it.

the motor has about 1000 miles on it. last weekend i started driving it hard and i lost oil pressure after a drive.

i now have 10 to 15 lbs of oil pressure cold at idle and 30 to 50 if i rev it high.

i called the builder and they said it sounds like bearings (they don't warranty bearings apparently) and i would need to pull the engine and send it to them. for tear down.

i have spoken to a few knowledgeable people and they think its more likely front cover o ring.

if it is a front cover oring then i could easily fix it my self with out pulling the engine. problem is if i do that i void the warranty.

the engine builder said "well if its been driving fine for a thousand miles then its nothing we did." so it sounds like my warranty is up anyways.

any ideas?

clokker

iTrader: (2)

Ask the builder if checking the o-ring voids the "warranty"...seems like they'd be eager to avoid an engine tear down on their dime.
I can't see how bearings could so radically change clearance in just 1000 miles unless something was really wrong with initial assembly.

Not sure how one would prove bad installation of the front cover o-ring as it seems like that would show up immediately but in any case, if that was the problem it's be easily fixed and your downtime would be minimal.

FelixIsGod29X

iTrader: (50)

Well first off i wouldnt drive a rebuilt turbo'd rotary with 1k miles "hard" till at least 3k....

EDIT: If they pressed in new rotor & stat gear bearings it actually takes long for the motor to break in because it needs many heat cycles and miles.

turbine

iTrader: (1)

a front cover o ring problem may have not shown up during the first 1000 miles because i was babying it. it never saw a lot of RPM.
just before this happened i changed the oil from 10/30 to 20/50 and then took the motor out to 8k RPM plus. my guess is that if the front cover o ring was pinched, the thicker oil and higher red line took it over the edge.

if i pull the front cover i void the warranty.

nofords

iTrader: (9)

To me it sounds like the front cover o-ring. It also sounds to me that it will be an uphill battle with your builder anyways.

No one wants to take credit for shotty work anymore. its always the end-users fault.

Boo-erns for you.

SirCygnus

iTrader: (1)

i have the same oil pressure at idle. it even dips into the 20's at idle and shoots up to like... 50 when i mash it.

my engine builder told me this is fine. the engine has lasted 2 years so i trust him.

turbine

iTrader: (1)

i just cut the oil filter open and is is clean not a single piece of metal. i doubt this is a bearing failure. the builder still thinks its bearings. i will give him another call

clokker

iTrader: (2)

Were the bearings replaced?

turbine

iTrader: (1)

yup new bearings

clokker

iTrader: (2)

Then this...
...makes no sense to me.
The only way for new bearings to fail within 1k miles is improper install/clearance.
Which definitely would seem to be a warranty repair.

turbine

iTrader: (1)

i pulled off the oil pan and found this in the pan
it is a paper like gasket material. clearly broken off somthing in the engine

the penny is just for refrence it was not in the engine

turbine

iTrader: (1)

here is a pic of a front cover gasket. it looks like this is the spot that broke off.

is that where the front cover oring goes?

red87tll

iTrader: (4)

yep, seems to be your issue right there

PvillKnight7

iTrader: (16)

Good work detective. Your engine builder fucked up and needs to fix his mistake for free. Warranty or not that is a noob mistake. I hope the other (two?) o-rings turn up when the front cover is pulled. They might be lost in your oil galleries waiting to clog up **** and starve one of your new bearings...

http://www.mazdatrix.com/faq/oring.htm

turbine

iTrader: (1)

Looks like its time to name names Atkins built this engine. and they want me to pull the motor so they can do a 20 minute repair at there shop.
i could fix this my self in about an hour and a half but it will void my warranty. i have lost a lot of confidence in Atkins. they were not very helpful, insisting it was a bearing failure. they say a front cover oring failure would not cause a huge loss of oil pressure but obviously this is what happened.

so it looks like i am going to repair this myself and void my warranty. i guess i will keep my fingers crossed that they didn't **** anything else up.

PvillKnight7

iTrader: (16)

??? Maybe you should try re explaining your situation to Atkins. You did experience a huge loss of oil pressure. Did you tell them what you found in the oil pan?

turbine

iTrader: (1)

yeah after i emailed him a picture he said that that it was obvious. he still said i have to pull my engine no exceptions if i want a warranty. im sorry but 10 hours of labor to pull my engine and a half a day driving there and back is not worth it.

atkins already stated that since the engine ran fine for a 1000 miles it was not likely there fault. that kind of attitude is a poor one when dealing with a customer who just paid you $3400 cash to build your engine.

all i want to do is repair the front cover with out voiding my warranty.

PvillKnight7

iTrader: (16)

Did you tell them you babied the engine for those 1000 miles like they recommend you do for the new bearings they installed? That as soon as you brought the revs above 4k you noticed a significant loss in oil pressure? Ask them what good is a warranty if they won't stand behind their engines? Tell them you suspect the front cover oil gallery o-rings weren't installed properly and/or the front cover wasn't torqued properly. Tell them you paid $3400 for a reliable engine and they failed to provide one. Ask them where your new engine is because the one in your car isn't what you paid for.

This should go without saying but always be polite. Write down your concerns in a letter and explain how you feel this matter should be resolved. Explain what service you expected and how you feel you are being mistreated. Make a copy of the letter and send it by certified US mail. Keep all the documentation in case the deal goes bad. Talking **** on the internet won't get results like a good lawyer.

mikeric

iTrader: (20)

Good info. Looks like I just had a similiar issue.