RETed

The first pic with the close-up of the "chewed up" apex seal groove would be most likely no good.

The second pic with the "dent" in the rotor face is okay to use in my book.
Damage to the rotor face don't really affect anything.
This is an non-turbo, right?
For non-turbos, combustion temps and pressures are not as high as turbo motors, and even ugly dents like that are not a big deal.


Ouch!
Yep, you're totally right on that point.


Wow, that's odd.
A few months ago, non-turbo rotors were being offered for sale almost every day!
I guess we're in a dry spell.
Check the For Sale section for 2nd gen parts, right?



Okay, and the apex seals are all intact and no chipped ends, right?
Just looking at the dimensions of the dent, it can only be a piece from the apex seal or an apex seal spring.


-Ted

RETed

This will depend on what the alpha code on your front spacer???
Can you check this out?
The spacers from Mazda are like 0.02mm difference.
If I do the math right, that's a LOT less than 0.002".

Scroll down to "end spacer chart"...
http://www.mazdatrix.com/b5.htm


-Ted

johnnyg

Actually, that's all on the same rotor face...the 2nd picture is just a bit lower then the first. Don't know why I bothered with 2 pics, really.
Correct.
Ouch!
Yep, you're totally right on that point.
Lucky me!
I have a post in the Canadian section - easier to try there first.

I'll have to look 'em over again. Everything appeared intact when I removed the housing, but the first apex seal I tried to pull out snapped in half and shot across the room. I believe it was just because that was the first time I had ever touched one and I torque it the wrong way (plus it has 200,000KM on it!)

Certainly looks like that to me, too. I'm just not sure where the heck it came from. There aren't too many possibiilties though!

johnnyg

But if I take .002" off each face, that's .008" total, equal to .02mm

Is it okay to do this and leave a nearly .002" groove? Or should I just use them as is, since they meet the minimum spec?? What would YOU do in my shoes?

johnnyg

What's the best way to get the exhaust manifold studs out of the housings? Using back-to-back nuts, I had little problem removing the top studs on each housing, but the bottom ones will barely move and I don't want to put too much pressure on them. I tried heat, but that seemed to make it worse!

RETed

Man, my math must be screwed. :P
I tried to punch it in, and I got 0.02mm x 25.4 = ~0.0007"?
It looks like I was off by one zero!


It depends on the iron...
If the groove isn't that bad (catch a fingernail?), I wouldn't bother lapping.
Lapping causes more headaches that it helps...


-Ted

RETed

I dunno what is best, but the double nut method works.

Yeah, some of them get pretty tight in there.

I would try and use some penetrant - i.e. WD-40, Liquid Wrench, PB Blaster, etc. - that might help.

The studs are pretty damn strong, and I'd be surprised if you actually managed to kill one.


-Ted

couturemarc

http://buy1.snapon.com/catalog/item....re&dir=catalog


best way to get a stud out, you can find cheaper ones but the Mac and Snap On ones are the best i've used yet, for the rotor housings i think you only need the #10 and #6 but im not sure.

RETed

I've used the Snap-On, and it's probably the most effective out of everything out there, but it's not perfect.
The really fine teeth still damages the threads on the studs, albiet not as bad as some of the cheaper units, but it still does some damage.
The double nut method almost always works when done right, and it does little damage.


-Ted

johnnyg

Umm...so was I! .008" = .2mm

I can certainly feel it with a fingernail, but I wouldn't say it catches.

As for the exhaust studs, I was more worried about stripping the threads in the housing then breaking the stud. Since I haven't read any cautions in this regard, I assume that shouldn't be much a concern.

RETed

If the "chrome" surfaces are intact (can you take a pic of this area?), I wouldn't bother lapping them.
What are you building the motor for?
To last another 200k miles?


Um, any reason why you're trying to remove them?
Are you trying to save the housing or the studs?
I'm a bit confused.


-Ted

johnnyg

Will post a pic tonight. The housings are very clean and I'm probably just over-reacting. These are the first I've ever seen in person, afterall. Definitely not expecting another 200K, but wouldn't that be a kick?!

I'm sending the housings to JHB and they said it would be nice if I removed the studs, but they're happy to do it too, so all's well. I could probably re-use the housings too, but they are definitely on the other side of the 'spec' line and I'm just more comfortable re-surfacing them. The chrome flaking isn't very deep into the housing, but althogether, nearly 1/2 way around the perimeter is flaking.

johnnyg

Well, talk about a change of plans! I was all ready to spend $800 on JHB resufacing, nearly $1500 on parts from Mazda, at least $100 for a new rotor, and hundred more on other odds and end.

Then, just before 5pm today, an ad shows up in the Canadian Buy/Sell section here...an S5 Mazda reman longblock with 90,000KM on it and in perfect working condition for...$500! How could I resist?!

I still might rebuild that, but if it's making good compression, what's the point? I guess I'll make that determination once I get the engine (next week sometime).

RETed

Geezuschrist...a $3,000 NA motor???
You ARE crazy!


-Ted

johnnyg

But don't forget....that's Canadian $$

RETed

Even at CDN$ it's still a lot!


-Ted

buttsjim

Well. I like this thread, so I think you should go ahead and rebuild your motor, and continue the discussion (maybe I'm being selfish).

johnnyg

No problem...just let me start a PayPal account for donations

I will still post pics of my existing internals. I was cleaning parts last night and never got around to that. I have a feeling most people would consider them all reusable.

Also, I'm still thinking about tearing apart the new motor, too. If everything's in spec, I'll only be out $250 for a gasket set. But I'm still fighting that "why mess with what works?" thing!

Fitness Stain

cause you might start it up and 4 weeks later .. pop ...

but you may install it and never have another problem ... ... its a gamble unless you know for sure how the shape of the internals are

johnnyg

True, but the smallest assembly error and I might cause a "pop" where one would not have happened otherwise. Oh what to do...what to do!! It's nice to have options, at least.

johnnyg

Here are a few pics of my parts. I'd love to hear opinions on how usable they look.

johnnyg

Regarding the new engine I'm buying, the current owner tells me that he dyno'd at 137HP at the wheels just a month ago, and the engine runs extremely well. The only reason he's selling it is because he's swapping for a TII drivetrain. So, there's really no reason to tear it down, which is just fine with me. Now I can spend money on some other upgrades and maybe a new carpet.

johnnyg

No opinions on these pics?? Do the parts look re-usable?

The Spyder

iTrader: (8)

I would not use either of those peices. The iron can be laped, but that housing looks like trash.

TII '87

rotor housings dont seem to be really good, but try to take pictures with a better lighting, cause if they are reallu rippled like that, that looks to be junk...

those irons seems ok... the water jackets seem to be really strong, no corrosion or ****

but I do admit that even if I dissasembled couple of engines, I never actually rebuilt one, so I'm not any kind of trustable guru....