mazdatrix-do they lie?
#76
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All I know is that it is a general concensus among tuners that a well running NA 13B will yield close to a 30% increase in power with a non-restrictive (way too loud) exhaust. Pettit, Mazdatrix, Rotary Performance, etc.
I have no first hand DYNO experience (aside from butt dyno), but I really doubt the major players in Rotary tuning would have all gotten together and threw a number out the air.
Obviously, someone's 13B with over 100k on it that's 11-15 years old isn't going to see a 30% increase in power. If that's your arguement, I agree.
I have no first hand DYNO experience (aside from butt dyno), but I really doubt the major players in Rotary tuning would have all gotten together and threw a number out the air.
Obviously, someone's 13B with over 100k on it that's 11-15 years old isn't going to see a 30% increase in power. If that's your arguement, I agree.
#77
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Hey did you actually look at the damn catalog they gained 28% at the wheels which if you look at the dyno sheet stock HP was 98hp so the gained 27hp and I wish my buddy still had his or I would have him go put it on the dyno for you because he had that exhaust and trust me there was a nice seat of the pants diff.
#79
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rotaries love different exhaust. By going with an SCCA ITA legal motor (stock internals, stock porting, stock intake manifolds, rejetted close to stock carb, etc..) with a Heintz Bros. Intake filter setup, balanced, and their exhaust, SDJ Motorsports goes from the 100 stock HP to like 172 on a friggin' mostly stock 12A.
#82
Originally posted by AbecX
wpgrexx, no one has proved anything, and a little uninformed terd ike yourself isnt going to run me out.
wpgrexx, no one has proved anything, and a little uninformed terd ike yourself isnt going to run me out.
I HAVE PROOF
CLICK HERE
NOW, shut the **** up forever about how turdy N/A's are.
#83
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Originally posted by AbecX
wpgrexx, no one has proved anything, and a little uninformed terd ike yourself isnt going to run me out.
wpgrexx, no one has proved anything, and a little uninformed terd ike yourself isnt going to run me out.
one thing i am not is little, call me a terd all u want though, the dyno sheet is right here on the page. can't u read.
#84
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Originally posted by AbecX
Your not teaching me anything, 28% increase in horsepower is a false claim and believing that your going to get that make that kind of power is like believing Al Gore made the internet. Like I said, I imagine no more then 10rwhp on a stock rx7 n/a with full exhaust and no other mods.
Your not teaching me anything, 28% increase in horsepower is a false claim and believing that your going to get that make that kind of power is like believing Al Gore made the internet. Like I said, I imagine no more then 10rwhp on a stock rx7 n/a with full exhaust and no other mods.
#87
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AbecX, you have no understanding of a rotary engine, so you're not about to be able to comprehend why opening the exhaust is so beneficial. As I stated before, when a piston engine fires, there is no force behind the piston PREVENTING it from moving downwards, on a rotary, there is a force behind the rotor preventing it from rotating freely, which is called exhaust. This is because there's no fancy valve system, and the exhaust port is always open, and it's always putting pressure on the rotor. The less pressure on the rotor, the easier it will spin, which IMPROVES performance. This has been proven in the dyno that you believe is 'fake'. If you had any mechanical ability, you would be able to see that reducing restriction in exhaust allows the rotors to spin a hell of a lot easier, and don't bother telling me about a restriction in a piston engine, because the restriction isn't preventing the crankshaft from spinning freely. This is provable by simply looking at the design of the RX-7. How much of an increase is this? This is stated by mazdatrix, and proven by them as well. If you want to act childish, or defend your manhood by denying something you obviously know nothing about, that is fine, go right ahead, because you've been proven wrong more than once. Look at the way it's designed and if you can't tell why improving exhaust flow is so important to the rotary engine, then you lack the capabilities to argue this at all.
#89
Originally posted by AbecX
You'll get no complaints out of me. I already know how the exhaust works on the rotor, and also some of that back pressure helps to pull in new air on the rotors next cycle.
You'll get no complaints out of me. I already know how the exhaust works on the rotor, and also some of that back pressure helps to pull in new air on the rotors next cycle.
#90
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This is kinda getting silly...
Have you people even concidered this:
A Stock 86 n/a FC is rated at aprox 140 HP at the flywheel..
Taking in account for 15% driveline losses, that puts you at aprox 119 HP at the wheels..
MazdaTrix Dynoed their 86 n/a at 98HP at the wheels.. now add that 15% figure and you come out with 113 HP to the flywheel... a 27HP diffrence from stock figures
Now they install their exhaust system and this time they dynoed 125 to the wheels or roughly 143HP to the flywheel...
wow.. they gained 3 HP to the flywheel over a stock properly running n/a!
Do you people actually belive that they would have seen as great of an increase in power if they had dynoed a car that was running within spec in the first place?? Doubtful.. It's called marketing and many of you are falling for it..
I could dyno my T2 at 100 hp to the flywheel because of a severly clogged airfilter .. then install a diffrent airfilter and then dyno at 160 hp... a 60% increase in HP, with just a cone filter! how laughable would that be??
Have you people even concidered this:
A Stock 86 n/a FC is rated at aprox 140 HP at the flywheel..
Taking in account for 15% driveline losses, that puts you at aprox 119 HP at the wheels..
MazdaTrix Dynoed their 86 n/a at 98HP at the wheels.. now add that 15% figure and you come out with 113 HP to the flywheel... a 27HP diffrence from stock figures
Now they install their exhaust system and this time they dynoed 125 to the wheels or roughly 143HP to the flywheel...
wow.. they gained 3 HP to the flywheel over a stock properly running n/a!
Do you people actually belive that they would have seen as great of an increase in power if they had dynoed a car that was running within spec in the first place?? Doubtful.. It's called marketing and many of you are falling for it..
I could dyno my T2 at 100 hp to the flywheel because of a severly clogged airfilter .. then install a diffrent airfilter and then dyno at 160 hp... a 60% increase in HP, with just a cone filter! how laughable would that be??
#91
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Originally posted by Barwick
rotaries love different exhaust. By going with an SCCA ITA legal motor (stock internals, stock porting, stock intake manifolds, rejetted close to stock carb, etc..) with a Heintz Bros. Intake filter setup, balanced, and their exhaust, SDJ Motorsports goes from the 100 stock HP to like 172 on a friggin' mostly stock 12A.
rotaries love different exhaust. By going with an SCCA ITA legal motor (stock internals, stock porting, stock intake manifolds, rejetted close to stock carb, etc..) with a Heintz Bros. Intake filter setup, balanced, and their exhaust, SDJ Motorsports goes from the 100 stock HP to like 172 on a friggin' mostly stock 12A.
FWIW I'm a mechanic. Unlike 90% of the people that posted in this thread, I actually DO know how a rotary engine works. There is no way in hell that any stock N/A rotary engine will see 28% increase in ANY exhaust mod. You people can flame me all you want but you only make yourself look stupid to those who know what they are talking about.
Good ITS(2nd genN?/A) cars make around 175hp. These are race cars with full free flowing RACE exhaust and mods to the stock intake.
Good IT7(ITA) cars (1st gen 12A) Make around 125hp with full RACE exhaust and mods to the stock carb.
Now by RACE exhaust I don't mean these quiet little presilencer, true dual, muffled exhaust you get from RB or Mazdatrix. I'm talking about 3 inch pipes dumping out a straight threw muffler or no muffler at all.
You guys are funny,
Mike
Last edited by stinkfist; 06-26-02 at 07:20 PM.
#92
C'mon guys you know Chris is right on this one. marketing ploy! If this were true, putting this exhaust on will get you more power than a stock turbo of the same year, atleast as much. All you guys wanting the N/A to t2 conversion, forget it, swap the exhaust and be done with it!
#93
thank you stinkfist. Now if you can just convince the folks on this forum that they won't see a 15HP gain by putting a cone filter, more so without a cold air box, I would appreciate it very much!
#94
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Originally posted by rxseven
thank you stinkfist. Now if you can just convince the folks on this forum that they won't see a 15HP gain by putting a cone filter, more so without a cold air box, I would appreciate it very much!
thank you stinkfist. Now if you can just convince the folks on this forum that they won't see a 15HP gain by putting a cone filter, more so without a cold air box, I would appreciate it very much!
Mike
#95
Originally posted by rxseven
thank you stinkfist. Now if you can just convince the folks on this forum that they won't see a 15HP gain by putting a cone filter, more so without a cold air box, I would appreciate it very much!
thank you stinkfist. Now if you can just convince the folks on this forum that they won't see a 15HP gain by putting a cone filter, more so without a cold air box, I would appreciate it very much!
#96
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There are so many math tricks and **** ups by so many people on this thread, I'm going to go puke. Exhaust will have a noticeable impact. If it doesn't it wouldn't sell because nearly everyone who buys exhaust asks others for their experience first. If the Exhaust didn't perform up to expectations, word of mouth advertising would be negative, and product wouldn't sell. I have no experience with this, so I must take the experience of others, apply my capacity for RATIONAL thought, and come to my own conclusions. It appears that with some people, logic is futile. So...
to the Nay sayers unwilling to believe (within rational tolerances) the proof offered:
Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up!
to the Nay sayers unwilling to believe (within rational tolerances) the proof offered:
Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up! Shut the F up!
#97
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Stinkfist, You don't know what you are talking about. Quote :"FWIW I'm a mechanic. Unlike 90% of the people that posted in this thread, I actually DO know how a rotary engine works. There is no way in hell that any stock N/A rotary engine will see 28% increase in ANY exhaust mod. You people can flame me all you want but you only make yourself look stupid to those who know what they are talking about.
***** I have seen on a first gen 101 hp to 129 hp with a full exhaust. Mazdatrix (Dave Lemon) just forwarded the stats as it's a racing beat exhaust. Joe @ Rotary Engineering actually saw a 33% gain with their system and with twin webbers the hp went up to 154 hp. These numbers are at the crank. I have been building, porting (street, bridge, pp) turbos, Nos and supercharged rotaries for over 20 years.
***** I have seen on a first gen 101 hp to 129 hp with a full exhaust. Mazdatrix (Dave Lemon) just forwarded the stats as it's a racing beat exhaust. Joe @ Rotary Engineering actually saw a 33% gain with their system and with twin webbers the hp went up to 154 hp. These numbers are at the crank. I have been building, porting (street, bridge, pp) turbos, Nos and supercharged rotaries for over 20 years.
Last edited by Mr rx-7 tt; 06-26-02 at 10:27 PM.
#98
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Just to give you guys some ideas on n/a hp, I have been tracking my efforts on my n/a with a G-tech and some other n/a's as well..
Now get this, most bone stock FC's will show no more than about 50 hp on a g-tech, I kid you not..
With cat back exhaust, I personally went from 50 to about 70 hp on the g tech, with pre-silencer and midipe I put down about 85, with a header, k&n, fixing the sixth ports nailed me up 93, then with the throttle body mod, some tuning via ignition timing, and port opening rpm, I nailed 107 hp on the g -tech, so with my mods I saw over a 100 % increase in power.. And as it has been saying a 100% increase of what, if you took mazda's number and added a 100%, well thats about 300 hp then..NOT.. The n/a advertised at 146 hp, was nowhere near that,, mine was in decent tune for a stocker and made 50.. So yeah its marketing...
Mazda has always been a little out to lunch on there Hp numbers, most recently they got on the miata.. Seems to me they may be taking to many lessons from Ford..
So how fast is an n/a with full custom exhaust.. well not really that fast at all, noisy then all hell, but its like watching syrup pour sometimes..Max
Now get this, most bone stock FC's will show no more than about 50 hp on a g-tech, I kid you not..
With cat back exhaust, I personally went from 50 to about 70 hp on the g tech, with pre-silencer and midipe I put down about 85, with a header, k&n, fixing the sixth ports nailed me up 93, then with the throttle body mod, some tuning via ignition timing, and port opening rpm, I nailed 107 hp on the g -tech, so with my mods I saw over a 100 % increase in power.. And as it has been saying a 100% increase of what, if you took mazda's number and added a 100%, well thats about 300 hp then..NOT.. The n/a advertised at 146 hp, was nowhere near that,, mine was in decent tune for a stocker and made 50.. So yeah its marketing...
Mazda has always been a little out to lunch on there Hp numbers, most recently they got on the miata.. Seems to me they may be taking to many lessons from Ford..
So how fast is an n/a with full custom exhaust.. well not really that fast at all, noisy then all hell, but its like watching syrup pour sometimes..Max
#99
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Originally posted by Maxthe7man
Just to give you guys some ideas on n/a hp, I have been tracking my efforts on my n/a with a G-tech and some other n/a's as well..
Now get this, most bone stock FC's will show no more than about 50 hp on a g-tech, I kid you not..
With cat back exhaust, I personally went from 50 to about 70 hp on the g tech, with pre-silencer and midipe I put down about 85, with a header, k&n, fixing the sixth ports nailed me up 93, then with the throttle body mod, some tuning via ignition timing, and port opening rpm, I nailed 107 hp on the g -tech, so with my mods I saw over a 100 % increase in power.. And as it has been saying a 100% increase of what, if you took mazda's number and added a 100%, well thats about 300 hp then..NOT.. The n/a advertised at 146 hp, was nowhere near that,, mine was in decent tune for a stocker and made 50.. So yeah its marketing...
Mazda has always been a little out to lunch on there Hp numbers, most recently they got on the miata.. Seems to me they may be taking to many lessons from Ford..
So how fast is an n/a with full custom exhaust.. well not really that fast at all, noisy then all hell, but its like watching syrup pour sometimes..Max
Just to give you guys some ideas on n/a hp, I have been tracking my efforts on my n/a with a G-tech and some other n/a's as well..
Now get this, most bone stock FC's will show no more than about 50 hp on a g-tech, I kid you not..
With cat back exhaust, I personally went from 50 to about 70 hp on the g tech, with pre-silencer and midipe I put down about 85, with a header, k&n, fixing the sixth ports nailed me up 93, then with the throttle body mod, some tuning via ignition timing, and port opening rpm, I nailed 107 hp on the g -tech, so with my mods I saw over a 100 % increase in power.. And as it has been saying a 100% increase of what, if you took mazda's number and added a 100%, well thats about 300 hp then..NOT.. The n/a advertised at 146 hp, was nowhere near that,, mine was in decent tune for a stocker and made 50.. So yeah its marketing...
Mazda has always been a little out to lunch on there Hp numbers, most recently they got on the miata.. Seems to me they may be taking to many lessons from Ford..
So how fast is an n/a with full custom exhaust.. well not really that fast at all, noisy then all hell, but its like watching syrup pour sometimes..Max
Last edited by Mr rx-7 tt; 06-26-02 at 11:23 PM.