help with ignition/starter trigger wiring
03-06-12, 10:59 PM
#1
mmm doritos
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: lancaster PA
Posts: 2,107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
help with ignition/starter trigger wiring
hello, i have a 88 convertible that i had the interior out of to restore it and i had the whole ignition removed, so i was starting it with just a screw driver in the little plastic piece that the key would normally turn, and it started fine that way for months pulling it in and out of my shop, then i finished the paint job and the car had to be stored outside under covers and tarps for about a month, then i go out to start it and i get nothing, changed the battery and i changed ignition switches, everything works like headlights and all that but when i go to start it i get nothing...no click or anything, however, i jacked it up and jumped the thick battery wire to the starter then to that spade connector which has to be the trigger wire from the ignition, the car started right up! what could possibly just cause this to happen all the sudden? could it be a relay that got wet and corroded inside? i also tested my clutch safety swich and its good to go..whats next??:scratch
03-08-12, 06:32 PM
#3
mmm doritos
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: lancaster PA
Posts: 2,107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
yes everything works, lights go up and down and turn on, interior lights work and so do the wipers turn signals and convertible top...im totally stumped on this one and ive even been following an official factory FSM...it dosent tell you how to test the starter relay or the interlock switch so im lost..guess ill just try and replace those two parts..anyone else have any ideas?
03-08-12, 07:01 PM
#4
Rotary Freak
IF you really have a STARTER CUT RELAY...........then pull the elect plug off it. Make a jumper wire and install it in the elect plug you just pulled off. Jumper the large Black/Green wire to the large BLACK/WHITE wire in that connector. Then try to start the engine.
That can prove two things. One.......if the starter still does not crank it means no power is getting tothe large Black/Green wire in that connector and or can prove that the relay itself is not the problem.
That relay is in a relaxed positon if there is no theft problems with the theft unit, and when in the relaxed positon the contacts will pass power from the Black/Green to the Black/White wire making the starter turn over.
When holding the key to START your meter should show batt voltage on the Black/Green wire. Does it? IF not, then the problem is prior to the relay/elect plug. That's where I'd start with this.
And or if you want pull that elect plug off and jumper power from the batt positive post to the large Black/Green wire. Starter should turn over doing this........proving the wiring from that connector to the starter solenoid is good. If it does not turn over, then that one connector b/t the starter cut relay and the starter solenoid is disconnected or????? (not likely, but?).
No power at the Black/Green could also mean the clutch interlock switch is not being "made" when the clutch pedal is depress and not letting power from the ignition switch get to the starter solenoid.
I sure would not go and buy a new relay who spends its life in a relaxed postion with it's internal contacts "making" all the time. That relay only opens the start circuit IF the THEFT unit puts power on that relay which in turn opens the start circuit.
Got no factory theft??? Then you have no starter cut relay at all. You have a BLUE jumper plug connected to the harness instead of the relay being connected to the harness.
The BLUE jumper plug would be located below the Trail coil assy area.
That can prove two things. One.......if the starter still does not crank it means no power is getting tothe large Black/Green wire in that connector and or can prove that the relay itself is not the problem.
That relay is in a relaxed positon if there is no theft problems with the theft unit, and when in the relaxed positon the contacts will pass power from the Black/Green to the Black/White wire making the starter turn over.
When holding the key to START your meter should show batt voltage on the Black/Green wire. Does it? IF not, then the problem is prior to the relay/elect plug. That's where I'd start with this.
And or if you want pull that elect plug off and jumper power from the batt positive post to the large Black/Green wire. Starter should turn over doing this........proving the wiring from that connector to the starter solenoid is good. If it does not turn over, then that one connector b/t the starter cut relay and the starter solenoid is disconnected or????? (not likely, but?).
No power at the Black/Green could also mean the clutch interlock switch is not being "made" when the clutch pedal is depress and not letting power from the ignition switch get to the starter solenoid.
I sure would not go and buy a new relay who spends its life in a relaxed postion with it's internal contacts "making" all the time. That relay only opens the start circuit IF the THEFT unit puts power on that relay which in turn opens the start circuit.
Got no factory theft??? Then you have no starter cut relay at all. You have a BLUE jumper plug connected to the harness instead of the relay being connected to the harness.
The BLUE jumper plug would be located below the Trail coil assy area.
03-09-12, 11:28 PM
#6
mmm doritos
Thread Starter
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: lancaster PA
Posts: 2,107
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
ok so i have no juice at the black/green wire at the relay plug. what would cause that not to have power? i also tested the clutch safety switch and its operating correctly, however on this rx7 it has what looks like a second switch mounted on the floor under the clutch pedal and this switch is pushed in when you press in the clutch rather then releasing the switch like the other clutch safety switch, what is this second switch? i cant even find it in the FSM??
03-10-12, 07:32 AM
#7
Rotary Freak
There's two clutch switches. One way up high and this switch is the clutch interlock switch and it has two wires. One wire black/red and the other black/green. This switch is the one that is part of the start circuit.
You have to have that switch in working condition for power to get to the starter solenoid.
On a series FOUR car power leaves the ignition switch ..........goes to the clutch interlock switch..........passes thru the clutch interlock switch if the pedal is depressed........goes to the plug that is attached to the starter cut relay (or the BLUE jumper plug if not factory theft equipped).........passes thru the starter cut relays contacts as long as there is no theft issue.........goes to another elect plug located about a foot below the brake master cylinder area.........then on to the starter solenoid.
The lower switch on the clutch is to let the ECU know the pedal is depressed and or for the cruise control unit to kill cruise control when the clutch pedal is depressed. Has zip to do with the starter circuit.
I assumed when you checked for power at the black/green wire that you had the clutch pedal depressed and key HELD to START.
You have to have that switch in working condition for power to get to the starter solenoid.
On a series FOUR car power leaves the ignition switch ..........goes to the clutch interlock switch..........passes thru the clutch interlock switch if the pedal is depressed........goes to the plug that is attached to the starter cut relay (or the BLUE jumper plug if not factory theft equipped).........passes thru the starter cut relays contacts as long as there is no theft issue.........goes to another elect plug located about a foot below the brake master cylinder area.........then on to the starter solenoid.
The lower switch on the clutch is to let the ECU know the pedal is depressed and or for the cruise control unit to kill cruise control when the clutch pedal is depressed. Has zip to do with the starter circuit.
I assumed when you checked for power at the black/green wire that you had the clutch pedal depressed and key HELD to START.
Trending Topics
03-10-12, 07:36 AM
#8
Rotary Freak
Clutch interlock switches sometimes fail due to how they contact the clutch pedal.
You could just pull the elect plug off the clutch interlock switch and then jumper the half of the plug that is part of the front harness and that would simulate the pedal being depressed and bypass the interlock switch altogether. I've done that on one of my cars to make life easier on me when working on the car.
INterlock switch has the black/red and black/green wires. If the switch your looking at has different colors...........it ain't the clutch interlock switch.
Starter circuit is in the attached jpg. Power starts up at the top of the picture at the S which represents the key being held to START..........goes down on a B/R wire to the clutch interlock switch and passes thru that swtich and comes out as a B/G wire..........and continuse of to the starter cut relay which is relaxed if there are no theft problems going on, and passes thru that relays contact and leaves that relay as a B/W wire and continues on to a plug called FE-06 which it passed thru and goes right to the starter solenoid.
So.....I'd find the interlock switch.........pull its plug apart and jumper the half of the plug that is in the front harness (B/R to the B/G). Then put the meter on the B/.G wire at the starter cut relays plug (or where the BLUE jumper was connected, depends if you have theft protection or not) and then key held to START. Power should show up at the B/G . IF so........then put the BLUE connector back on the harness and try to start the car.
You didn't mention if you have theft protection or the BLUE jumper plug and this makes it harder to write clearly about how the start circuit works.
I didn't color the wire in the circuit that is spliced in and goes to the Blower unit. All that does is put power to a relay in the blower unit to disable the blower when you hold the key to Start. There is another spliced wire that I didn't color and it goes to the ECU and have nothing to do with the starter itself.........but is important in that it lets the ECu know your starting the car so the ECU will now use what if called a START FUEL MAP that is for fuel injection amout only when the rpms are under 500 rpm and key is held to START. Not related to your problem with the starter in any way.
You could just pull the elect plug off the clutch interlock switch and then jumper the half of the plug that is part of the front harness and that would simulate the pedal being depressed and bypass the interlock switch altogether. I've done that on one of my cars to make life easier on me when working on the car.
INterlock switch has the black/red and black/green wires. If the switch your looking at has different colors...........it ain't the clutch interlock switch.
Starter circuit is in the attached jpg. Power starts up at the top of the picture at the S which represents the key being held to START..........goes down on a B/R wire to the clutch interlock switch and passes thru that swtich and comes out as a B/G wire..........and continuse of to the starter cut relay which is relaxed if there are no theft problems going on, and passes thru that relays contact and leaves that relay as a B/W wire and continues on to a plug called FE-06 which it passed thru and goes right to the starter solenoid.
So.....I'd find the interlock switch.........pull its plug apart and jumper the half of the plug that is in the front harness (B/R to the B/G). Then put the meter on the B/.G wire at the starter cut relays plug (or where the BLUE jumper was connected, depends if you have theft protection or not) and then key held to START. Power should show up at the B/G . IF so........then put the BLUE connector back on the harness and try to start the car.
You didn't mention if you have theft protection or the BLUE jumper plug and this makes it harder to write clearly about how the start circuit works.
I didn't color the wire in the circuit that is spliced in and goes to the Blower unit. All that does is put power to a relay in the blower unit to disable the blower when you hold the key to Start. There is another spliced wire that I didn't color and it goes to the ECU and have nothing to do with the starter itself.........but is important in that it lets the ECu know your starting the car so the ECU will now use what if called a START FUEL MAP that is for fuel injection amout only when the rpms are under 500 rpm and key is held to START. Not related to your problem with the starter in any way.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
windom
Adaptronic Engine Mgmt - AUS
4
09-11-15 04:48 AM
