bhaley66

My headlights are not popping up in my 89 vert...

When i got the car, the headlights were down, the main fuse under the hood was taken out. When the car and headlights were off, i put the fuse in, and they popped up, then they would not go back down... I was able to turn the little **** on the bottom of the headlight assembly and they would retract, then pop right back up.

I searched the topic the last couple days, and found out where someone had the same problem. What i came across while searching was that someone told them to jump the wires to make them go down. If they went down then it was the switch that was bad.

I jumped the wires and they went down, when i plug the switch back in when the fuse is in, they come back up, and wont go back down. So for the mean time i got them down and pulled the fuse.

Yesterday i got another switch (used) and tried it, same exact problem.

My question is; what else may it be, or is it for sure that the switch is broken and i need a new one? Also in the post i was reading he mentioned that it may be the relay inside the switch, can i replace that? Where inside the switch is it?


thanks,
Brandon

misterstyx69

iTrader: (142)

try the headlight Relay...search the FSM to find it.(I'm not exactly sure if it on the front or near the passenger side if the car).

bhaley66

ok so i checked out the relay with a voltmeter tonight, i think i did it wrong though, i did not get a reading, however when i had it unplugged, the headlights would not turn on, but with it in they do, they just dont pop up...

what should i do? i feel kinda helpless when it comes to electrical...lol

thanks

HAILERS

I really don't believe there is a external retract relay on series five like there was on early series four car. That relay is internal to the headlight switch.

Might be the headlight switch assy in your dash. OR a blown RETRACT FUSE in the engine bay. Check RETRACT RELAY in the engine bay first.

From the jpg attached you can see in the headlight SWITCH, there is a retract relay that can effect the up/down motion of the headlight assy's. Seems to me you could unplug that switch, then jumper the R/L and R wires in the elect plug. Headlights should rise on up. IF they do,then the problem lies most likely in the switch assy. IF not, then the problem lies outside the switch assy.

The headlight relay in front of the radiator area............does not control the retraction of the headlights. It controls high and low beams.

bhaley66

ok, thats pretty much what i was thinking, i did the jumping of wires and came up thinking it had to be in the switch. I have 2 switches, and they both seem to have the same problem, is it unreasonable to think that they are both bad? is there a way to replace the relay inside the headlight switch, or is it easier, cheaper to just replace the switch for one said to work?

thanks

bhaley66

also is there any possibility that it could be anything else, if when i jump the wires they work? I ask, because if i buy a switch on ebay and it doesnt work, i want to be positive that the switch is bad so i can resolve the issue with the seller...

lonewolfrx

You can check the contacts in the switch to see if theres any corrosion or burnt parts. My fc had a a couple electrical problems. I changed my wiper switch so many times its not funny. For a temp fix you could disconnect the retractor motors and just leave the pop ups up .

bhaley66

i think ill pull the switch off at lunch time, and see if i can tell if anything is obviously wrong...

HAILERS

If you jumper the wires I mentione and the headlight assy go up..........the switch is bad. I know nothing about the internals of the headlight switch and never want to ever, ever know a thing as to how to fix the guts of it. Never ever.

I kinda sorta drew the path thru the switch all wrong....sorta. When you turn the **** to headlights on, you put a ground on the relay called Headlight Retactor Motor Relay, which already has power on it from the headlight fuse in the engine bay. The relay pulls in and feeds power from the headlight fuse.......thru the relays contacts.........out the switch assy on the R/L wire to the Retract Motor and everything comes up and everybody's happy.

Bad switch. You KNOW the headlight fuse is good because I think you say the headlights themselves come on. I don't know if the Retract fuse is good 'cause your the only one who has looked at it. I'd pull the plug on either of the headlight motors and with a meter see if the W/G wire has power on it or not. See attached wiring diagram for the W/G wire.

Takes both headlight and retract fuses to be good for the RETRACT MOTOR to function. Gotta have both good.

bhaley66

Well the fuses are good for sure... And the headlights do pop up when i jump the wires, so i guess that all there is to do is toss the two switches i have and buy a new one...

thanks a bunch for the help...
gotta go spend some more money

satch

iTrader: (1)

It's often a good idea to replace the headlight harness as well for it kills two birds with one stone. Some do not do this and get a new switch and it fries again. Haste makes waste.

EDIT This link provides important details: https://www.rx7club.com/2nd-gen-archive-72/heavy-duty-light-switch-operation-how-too-prevent-burnout-164931/

nillahcaz

iTrader: (2)

Umm... did you check the switch right above the head light switch? there one just to make them pop up with out turning on so you can change bulbs.

HAILERS

It would be interesting as to what happens if THAT **** is put to UP. Do the headlight assy go up? or do they still stay down????? IF nothing happens when that **** just above the headlight switch **** is put UP, then it seems for sure the relay inside the headlight switch assy is kaput/contacts broken/burnt. What I'm saying, is that the Headlight Retractor Motor passes power to the Headlight Retractor switch (**** above the headlight switch ****) IF the headlight switch **** is in the OFF positon. So with headlight switch **** OFF the Headlight Retractor switch is powered up and should be able to make the headlight assys go up/down by using that **** above the headlight switch ****.

Heck, what I wrote even confuses me. Trying to say.......try that other **** above the headlight switch **** , with the headlight switch in the OFF positon and see what happens. That **** above only works with the headlight switch in the OfF positon.

No matter though, the headlight switch assy is still broken internally even if the **** above the headlight switch works. I don't remember, but I think the headlights switch are series sensitive. That's from memory......not 100%sure 'bout that.

bhaley66

I have tried that switch both ways with the headlights on and off, with both switches i have, nothing happens. It does not matter if it is in the up position or down, with the headlights on or off, when i plug the switch in with the retractor fuse in, the headlights pop up, and wont go back down. I have to jump the wires to get them to go back down. So by what you are saying is that there is no doubt that i need a new switch; correct?

As far as changing the harness, I'm going to read the thread in the link before i post my questions...lol

thanks,
Brandon

bhaley66

ok i read the thread in the link, ill probably do that before i install a new switch.

Does anyone know how to save a thread, i cant subscribe to it because its archived...

HAILERS

What happens if you jumper the red wire to the R/L wire (red/blue)???????? They go down or stay up?????

EDIT: sorrrry, you already said that swtich won't make them go down. Then again, with the headlights up, and the switch disconnected, what happens if R is jumpered to R/Y?

These switches should have continuity b/t R and R/Y (**** in Down position) and b/t R and R/L(**** in UP position .....depending where the top **** is at a given time. The positon of the wiper switch itself when doing the aforemention, matters not.


Still sounds like the switch. I'd take out the switch and try to ohm out the switch itself where the red wire connects to the switch and to where the R/Y wire would attach to the switch. Should ohm out when that OTHER switch is put to the direction that is OFF. IN other words ohm out just like the diagram in my first post.

Again, I don't know for sure if these switches are series sensitive. Series four lights attached. Wire colors are the same for up/down vs R.

HAILERS

https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.p...INTERCHANGABLE

bhaley66

ill try to jump the wires mentioned tonight if i can find time. As far as "ohm out", excuse my ignorance, but i did not understand what you were talking about when you got to the 2nd to last paragraph and on...lol

However i should be able to jump the wires with the switch unplugged, and make the headlights go up or down, correct?

satch

iTrader: (1)

These switches should have continuity b/t R and R/Y (**** in Down position) and b/t R and R/L(**** in UP position .....depending where the top **** is at a given time. The positon of the wiper switch itself when doing the aforemention, matters not.

What this means in this instance is if you take your multimeter set to ohms and you place one lead,any lead, to the Red wire and the other lead to the Red/Yellow wire you should get a reading of zero on the meter taking into account the positions of the larger ****(up/down position) and smaller ****(up/down position). Same thing applies for finding zero ohms between the Red wire and the Red/Blue wire. This checks for continuity. If for example you had a spare piece of wire lying around and you placed both leads of the ohm meter on either end and the wire was free of any breaks or shorts the signal will pass from one end to the other without any interruptions and would give you a zero ohms reading (or very close to it). Before checking for ohms you should turn on the meter, set to ohms, and place both leads of the meter firmly together and the meter should read zero. Then conduct your ohm/continuity test.

Also when checking for ohms there cannot be any voltage running to the circuit you are testing or you could damage the circuit. In the instance above if the plugs are disconnected then there is no voltage issue to worry about.

bhaley66

Ok now i know how to read for continuity, however, in this statement:

These switches should have continuity b/t R and R/Y (**** in Down position) and b/t R and R/L(**** in UP position .....depending where the top **** is at a given time. The positon of the wiper switch itself when doing the aforemention, matters not.

im guessing that wiper switch it supposed to be headlight switch?

i think ill try this tonight, i think i have a good enough understanding of how to do it...lol

satch

iTrader: (1)

If I had to "guess" I would say it pertains to the "headlight wiper motor"
available on some models.

HAILERS

Yeah, should have been headlight switch and not wiper. Had my head stuck in my dark spot when typing that earlier.

bhaley66

ok, still battling this problem. im sure that my ignorance on the issue is what is causing me frustration...

I checked the continuity, and decided that i needed a new switch, i found a cluster surround with switches on ebay that said it was in very good condition, however i just received it today and there are some problems with the surround, so i checked the switch before i installed it into the car, and think its bad. So i need to find out for sure before i talk to the seller...

This pic is looking at the back of the switch.
I have no experience with checking continuity before this issue.

When i check the continuity on these pins with both switches in the off position, the old one measures 130, when i check the new one it measures 115.

Am i checking it correctly, are they both bad switches? Are these the correct pins to check?

thanks for the help,
and please excuse my ignorance...

vezrias

iTrader: (1)

I have this same exact issue, I bought my s5 and the lights would not go down, even after using the manual *****, another thing. My cluster gauge lights do not work as well, Idk if those two are connected or not =[

bhaley66

Anyone?