fc3schick87

iTrader: (1)

i'm still having alot of problems with this. i'm extreamly rich under boost. i disabled my safcII i'm pretty much stock, with the mods listed in first post.

symptoms that are bothering me are as follows:
idle is still 10-9a/f ratio
under boost peaking at 6psi i am now also 11-10a/f

there hasto be something that i am missing.

s4tii engine in a base modle chassy with n/a wire harness, tii ecu, idle air mix screw has no responce to system. full block off plates. 3'' to 2.5 inch racing beat revII exhaust, 3'' intake with an air restriction simulating stock airbox air restriction. (ya dont ask, it was the fastest wait to get rid of boost spikes and it prevents me from hitting 15psi, i had an issue with my hardlines that took 4 hours to install the lines back onto the turbo, i have steal braided replacement for this said hardline but i am currently in the middle of body work and do not wish to be down for a week while porting turbo wastegates)

so thats whats going on . i dont care about the slight bump in rpm while idle. though i do notice that durring the idle, while its bumping about 300rpm, it does get more lean and more rich acording to the engines reving durring rough idle

SirCygnus

iTrader: (1)

you dont have a t2 AFM or MAP sensor?

are you sure your air fuel ratio is correct?

walken

iTrader: (6)

modded TB, lack of thermowax, no bac can make idle and general driveability suck.

have you checked your timing?

if you haven't you could:
try plugging your boost guage and pressure sensor to the lowest nipple on the front (facing alternator) of the throttle body. Then your fuel pressure regulator to the nipple on the left (firewall side) of the lower intake manifold.

block off plate could be leaking or you could have an electrical gremlin, but as soon as I read your post which stated no BAC I thought bingo.

fc3schick87

iTrader: (1)

the car wouldnt run with out it i thought . i definantly have tii stuff for that.

my concern isnt the idle bouncing. my recent reply was only stating that to help maybe pinpoint the problem. as far as the vacume lines you told me about. thats how they are routed.

honestly i'm about to just go haltech. i have one lined up i think. just need to see if i can get a line of credit for it

would an n/a fuel pump be doing this? i also didnt swich that over, mainly because i dont see high enough rpm to notice its lacking.

i do have slightly larger 2ndary injectors. 1st gen GXL i forget how large those are but not much larger.

pengarufoo

vacuum leaks

I know you say there are none, you probably have some.

HAILERS

Do you still have your Atmospheric Pressure Sensor? Inside the passengers foot well?

ITSWILL

iTrader: (12)

how are you reading the AFR?

fc3schick87

iTrader: (1)

i only have 3 vaccume lines and all the rest are nipples with rtv and zip ties. i've checked them. as well as rtv on the upper and lower intake and all that.
i've ALWAYS have had this problem since i've started the rx7 with the new engine.
i have no idea what that is. we didnt remove it. all we did was unpluged my n/a ecuand plugged in my tii ecu

lc-1 with a lap top, or just a regular guage. i verified the accuracy of the guage with the laptops readings

juan0

ok guy... look if you have a bouncy idle it's all about adjusting the TPS, and adjust the whooe throtle body... my friend said it took him a whole day of trial and error to get it right... what you do it take off the whole throttle body and messa round tiwht the screws that are at the right side of the T body... try bringing it in and put it on.. run the car and see how it idles.. bring them a little out.. put it on again... see how it idles.. to all this until you're happy with hwo the engine idles.. also yuo never know but it may be your TPS since the connections inside get get worn out and then it starts sending data that changes all the time.. so your idle also changes all the time... so i'd first adjust the throtle body and if nothing works go to the yunky(yunk yard) and get another one that looks still good

HAILERS

Go back to that variable resistor. Pull its plug off. Put the resistor in your back pocket. Key to ON. See if there's approx 4.5vdc on the brown/white wire of the electrical plug.....or not. Should be.

The screw in the variable resistor only turns about three quarters of a full turn. If yours spins 'round and 'round it's no good. Get another.

Take the variable resistor out of your rear pocket. Put the meter on ohms. Put one lead on the blade that sits sideways. Put the other lead on either of the other pins that are oriented in the same direction. Turn the screw slowly from one end of its range to the other. At the lowest it should read .5K ohms and at the highest about 4.5K ohms. That's K ohms.

No matter. The reading should vary as you turn the screw. If not get another.

A better way is to idle the engine til it gets fully hot. Unbolt the ECU but leave it's plugs connected. You do that so you can tilt the ECU to get better access to the wires on the plugs.

Back probe each wire of each plug and compare it with the readings in the FSM, section called FUEL AND EMISSIONS and the pages called CONTROL UNIT. See if there's anything abnormal with your output/inputs and what's called for in the FSM.

A working variable resistor can vary the afr a full point if my memory is right. Your 9afr is causing half your problems or more.

You real sure the 680's are in the secondary rail??????? I'd really have to work at it to get a 9afr on a stock ECU without some device attached to the ECU like a SAFC. In fact I don't think I could get 9afr with a stock ECU even by turning the variable resistor full rich at idle.

The more I think about 9afr the more I think the injectors are too big in the primarys.

N/A fuel pump is not a part of the problem in any way.

A water thermo sensor stuck on an output of 2-3vdc might cause a real rich afr. Ain't in the least bit likely though. To prove it you just pull the plug off the water thermo sensor. It defaults to 176* or rather the ECU does. IF the sensor was causing the problem, then now the afr would be leaner. Ain't likely though.

A rich idle, idles smoother than a lean idle. But too rich makes it get crummy again.

Next time your idle goes up/down, look at your SAFC and the idle readings on it. I bet money the reading isn't going up/down with your idle. It's something else. Well it should read one volt at idle on its output wire give or take a smidge. I forget what it should read on the SAFC. I forget if the SAFC read in volts or percentage. What does your SAFC read when the engine is hot and idling???? I'm interested in that.

EDIT: I looked at the SAFC manual online. It reads TPS in percentage. So at idle you should read 20% for TPS. That's because the voltage range is from 1-5vdc for the TPS and one volt dc is 20% of five volts. You can set your TPS using the SAFC. Just make sure the engine is up to being fully hot before doing so. Also you can look at the reading on the SAFC and push the pedal slowly down and slowly release the pedal and notice whether the reading goes reasonably smooth from full pedal down to full pedal being released.

HAILERS

I also agree with what was said earlier, about getting a fuel pressure gauge and tee'ing it into the fuel line to see just what the FPR is doing for you in the way of fuel pressure.

Just borrow a gauge and tee it into the pressure line AT where it attaches to the engine. Should be 28-31 at idle.

Also make sure the vacuum line on the FPR is indeed pulling vacuum. Just pull it off the FPR while idling and feel it.

HAILERS

Make something like the attached jpg. That's a little cobbled up with lines longer than required, but you get the idea. You'd KNOW if the FPR is the problem after using it....or not the problem.

Monkeyed with AFM's also can cause rich idle mixtures.

Saint313

simple fix. fuel pump. you need t2 fuel pump. the N/A fuel pump pumps alot more gas into the engine then a t2 engine needs. thus burning excessive gas, this causing it to run very rich and idle funny, get a t2 fuel pump and swap it with ur n/a, problem solved. the t2 fuel pump is set up to the perfect specs of the t2 engine. and the n/a does not match those specs. anytime you go from n/a to t2 u need to get everything compatible, if not you may have a running car but it will never run the way it should

HAILERS

That is BS. I've had a non turbo fuel pump feed a Turbo engine ECU and what was written above is flat wrong.

Simply look at the fuel pump output figures and you'll see the above post is not right. It's written in the FSM. Plain silliness to put it kindly.

The Turbo pump has a higher head pressure than the non turbo. I've run both in my car and never seen a 9afr in my life....at idle.

Even if you idle a turbo engine and write down the afr......then pull or extract the green/red wire from the ECU, the AFR will only modestly change. Say you have 13afr with the wire connected, meaning it's running off the approx 9vdc, then pull the green/red wire for a full batt/alt voltage at idle. The afr won't change more than .1-.3 afr.

fc3schick87

iTrader: (1)

WOAH ok first off this thread is VERY old i dont even care about it any more i am just going with haltech or apexi
2nd. if it was the tps wouldnt i have different symptoms. its to rich even under boost. idle bounces because of no BACV reTed has already made that clear to me.
3rd if it was my fuel pump pumping to much fuel dont you think ted would have said so? figures dont lie. my n/a fuel pump leans out at 6rpm fuel pressure and pumping efecting what injectors spit out? my bf runs a high psi on large with a HUGE fuel pump on his agresive set up. and his engine does not run rich. i would assume the injectors only spit out what they are ment to. unless there is a leaky injector i would assume fuel pump and fuel pressure would have little to do with how much fuel the injector spits unless its to lean.
with this being the case the ecu is telling the injectors to use to much fuel obiously making the issue a sensor or electrical or god knows what.

idk if this is true. this is just theory just like you guys are talking about. pullin it out of the air and attaching it to things i think i know and saying its true with little to nothing to back it up other then its what i think would be the issue. no hard evidence or research done on my part. i just think it would be the reason! so i am spitting it out and saying i am right every one is wrong! argue with me! but i am right! iam the best!!!!

and lastly ya'll are being DOWN RIGHT NOT NICE. arguing like little kids with only theory to back it up. its an rx7...... it could be a number of things!!!!!!! each rx7 is different and unique to itself. i simply layed out the facts and hoped some one would see what the obious issue was


[QUOTE=Saint313;8870986]simple fix. fuel pump. you need t2 fuel pump. the N/A fuel pump pumps alot more gas into the engine then a t2 engine needs. thus burning excessive gas, this causing it to run very rich and idle funny, get a t2 fuel pump and swap it with ur n/a, problem solved./QUOTE]

HAILERS

Your freakin nuts. I've run non turbo fuel pumps on turbo engines and I know what the fuel pressure is for both. I've pulled the green/red wire off the ECU on a turbo car and seen the difference in the fuel pressure. It's what I said it is.

What the heck do you mean GUESSING or THEORY? I've posted this on this same forum in the past and had bets with NZCONVERTIBLE on what the results would be. I'm not arguing. I'm stating how the cow chews the cabbage.

If you can't cut it with a stock ECU, good luck with the HalTech. You'll need it.