jon88se

Grip and Drift cars...this sounds a lot like a bad game known as Ridge Racer V

autocrash

Never played it, I'll stick to GT3

Dave-ROR

What car and what supension setup? spring rates, etc.

You have obviously never driven a properly setup road race FWD car. You can setup a suspension to do anything you want, understeer, be neutral or oversteer.

Who said anything about FWD owning RWD? I said it could own you (you=the drive, not a RWD car).

Depends on the series. IT there's a fair amount of FWD cars that are very fast, look at scott secks integra, I've seen it win ITS and smack down every single FC numerous times. It's all driver and car setup (mostly driver).

IMO, RWD is easier, safer and more fun to drive fast and at the limits compared to a properly setup road racing FWD car.

Ni5mo180SX

RR5 was pretty good. RR4 was my favorite in the series though

autocrash

nope I never have.. hey, and maybe if YOU can set up a suspension to do anything YOU want then you should quit whining about your car not straightening out coming outta corners and go fix your suspension?


Well thats pretty ****** unfair, have you seen me drive? do you know how my car is set up? thats what I ******* thought! So maybe you should just shut up eh?

Cool cool... I don't follow IT/ITS... seeing as how I'm canadian and all...
but I know that properly set up FWD cars can compete with RWD... for example the mazdaspeed proteges running against the 3 series BMWs in the Speed world touring cars...
But then in other series they just get owned.. like the poor CRX in the last race of ALMS weekend at LeMans... (lesson: turbo CRX's are not as fast as Porsches or Corvettes... )

I agree with you based on second hand information... but I haven't had enough time to drive a RWD car to find out....

Dave-ROR

Fix it? to go slower? no thanks.

Ok, I know you canadians are slow and all, but come on! haha by "own your ***" I meant "own the driver". I was not talking about you, or anyone else, in particular.

A friend of mine won his class at PPIHC with a civic too, FWD can be fast :P

MtnRacer

I really disagree with you. Having driven both FWD and RWD at the limit myself, I find that a FWD car is MUCH more predictable and safer machine to drive at high speeds. Understeer if very easy to control and is intuitive to correct because all you have to do is slow down. Oversteer, on the other hand, isn't intuitive at all and once you've swung the rear out, unless you're experienced, you're in deep doo-doo. I suppose this all depends on your definition of "properly set up road racing FWD car." But in general: Easier, safer? I'm no so sure. Fun on the other hand, RWD hands down!

Steve

Dave-ROR

this is the key: "properly setup road racing FWD car"

the definition of that is said to be "a fast FWD car is one in a constant state of oversteer". Not that hard to acheive really. 900lb front springs, 1300lb rear springs, 22-26mm rear sway bar and 24mm up front (in an integra) will be a very oversteer happy car.

FC Drifter

i refer to the folks who pop up asking questions about a superficial aspect of drifting. its not what they want to know, its why they want to know it that bothers me. i have no problem with someone who wants to know why drift cars wheels are cambered, but if someone pops up askng how to do it so he can "look drift", then that person is a poser. that person is rice. while i may have a slightly extreme attatchment to drifting, i feel justified the way i feel. i will give anyone who gives the impression of actual interest in the "sport" all the help they need. but these superficial poser riceboys get nothing.

autocrash

Damn... guess I took that WAY wrong...

I'm sorry that I blew up on you like that... just sometimes things like what I thought you were saying get to me...

Thank you for the clarification!

And I would tend to believe that FWD cars are faster on dirt (in general) than RWD...

(PPIHC = pikes peak international hill climb? in a civic? thats cool... )

And yeah FWD can be bloody fast too... (btw, what kind of car is your "set up" FWD car?)

RETed

Blake Fuller?


-Ted

HIMNI Racing

we've drifted a few times in my 88 TII weve even got the reverse 180 down to a mad art in my eclips. but most of my best drifting(and fun) is done on my quads. thers nothing like drifting completly side ways with all four wheels off the ground over a fourteen foot sand jump (holly **** now thats drifting) to each ther own.

photoresistor

iTrader: (5)

http://www.gbaprojects.com/rx7/driftgroup.mov

Its amazing to me to see the amount of control those people have.... when they're so close to the other cars and staying in formation and everything.

Flamin' NOS

I've been learning about drifting for a few years. No, I'm not an expert and I'm really not that good. But I've got sooo much respect for the abilities of the drivers who can do this well. Drifting is a pure test of driver skill and it's not about going around the track the fastest. But because it is so boistrous, it makes it easy for ricers to want to copy it. It's the driving equivalent of giant fighting robot stickers on the side of the car. Luckily for the pure drivers out there, the "posers" will weed themselves out by wrecking, dying, or the fad passing. I can see where the purists are coming from. If you are racing, why waste time sliding around like an *******? Well, it's pretty fun. It's better than drag racing at least.
steve

slidingsky

Exactly let the guys who want to be drifters bust up thier cars and either keep trying or get into something new. I definetly can say there is a drift style. First look at a drift tengoku then look at a Option magizine. The two are drift and circuit/drag racing mags. There is a diffrent style. All the drift FC look difrent then the drag and circuit cars. Well to me. Again theses are japanese cars.
Oh clardon. Hawaii is just home again. It doesnt feel any diffrent than when I let. Oh my Tii is doin ok, I still need to get it to a body shop but Im workin on power upgrades. I actually have money now. I was lookin at either a kaaz lsd or savin longer and getting a haltech. I think I can unload my ECU and harness to help out. Hows dan? and your RX-3

Dave-ROR

:thumbup:

N/P. It was easy enough to mixup :thumbup:

I will admit that the cars that beat my Conquest in the dirt were both FWD One eclipse turbo FWD and one Sentra SE-R. Oh well, was still DAMNED fun though.

yep. I'll post pics/vids of his cars soon.. once I get less lazy @ home..

An integra. the street setup is 450f/600r spring rates on bilsteins, the track setup varies in spring rate. however, I am bringing it back to stock (roll cage is out already, some engine mods are gone, etc). I got some debt to pay off so until the debt is gone...

Ted really does know everything :P when you coming to south florida or central florida? I'll buy you some drinks a the local strip club :thumbup: :P

autocrash

I think part of the reason why FWDs are faster on dirt is the ease of throttle steering (atleast on stock springs )... even when you get sliding in completely the wrong direction (off the road) you can almost always point the wheels and stomp to get you back.... (worked for me so far, but my car is an understeering monster... ...and its a good thing that it works... I'm sure my mother would not be happy to find her car in a ditch )

Your car sounds good, I wish I had the money to race anything... ...I can't even afford to bring my RX-7 to school with me....

hawk 7

iTrader: (2)

By doing this you are actually creating "driftstyle". Look at it like this a young guy reads the mags and watches the video, he see that you are good and asks you questions. He may not asked them the proper way (for whatever reason kids think you have to be hard or cool now days) but you brush him off. He then has to learn on his own. He gets pretty good and another kid asks him questions because you a too good to talk to him. He then proceeds to tell him about getting a drift exhaust and then it becomes reality the very thing that you don't want to happen. If someone is trying to learn just try to help them even if they are an *******.

FC Drifter

no, because if he actually goes out and learns on his own, then he will see that there is no drift style. he will see its not done for appearances, but for function. and after he learns, when/if someone asks him the same question he will be able to give the proper answer. the right answers are out there, and very easy to find. if someone is willing to take the time to actualy learn the proper way to do things, then they probably arent a poser. posers wouldnt look for the reason something is done, just how to do it. like riceboys and cut springs. its not properly lowered and would ride that way, but it looks lowered so its cool. same thing with cambered wheels. its cambered for a reason. but a poser wouldnt care why, he would just rig up his stock suspension or something to camber in the tires.

hawk 7

iTrader: (2)

I understand you point but how is he going to learn if no one is there to teach him. If someone who he thinks is knowlegable tells him to cut his springs and he does and the car drives like **** he probably thinks that ALL the cars drive like ****. Until someone takes him out and actually teaches him. Say if you have never riden in a Lamborghini and someone takes you for a ride and it has blown shocks. You would be so excited and just tell people it ran stiffer than you thought but that's how Lamborghini's must ride. Take a person who knows they will be able to tell something is wrong.

hawk 7

iTrader: (2)

Another point I forgot to make is form follows function. I think that is where all this "driftstyle" stuff is coming from. You don't actually try to look a certain way but if you want to have a good drift car they can all tend to start to look alike. Or a least follow the same formula in building one.

SlidinRX7

Amazingly enough I read through each post. Seems like a lot of you guys don't like drifting for whatever reason you have. Could be that you tried your hardest to understand it and pull it off. Might also be that you wrecked a few cars trying. Who knows, but my point is don't hate until you have the facts straight. You may think that drifting only consists of oversteering through a turn. Which is true, BUT not the only thing that's happening while drifting. Probably figure that powersliding at the exit of the turn is drifting too. WRONG, unless you keep it to connect multiple turns together while sliding. If you see some guy on the road drifting and mess up, don't get the wrong idea because you haven't seen REAL drifting unil you've seen the D1 grandprix in Japan. Or even a driver from the D1 drift. I was lucky enough to watch a driver, Fumiaki Komatsu(also a part of Signal Auto), from the D1 drift his car here in Hawaii. It takes such car control to do what they do. As for myself I am slowly learning how to do faster, longer, nicer drifts.

BTW, One thing I forgot to mention is that rally drifting and street/track drifting are similar yet very different. Don't get them mixed up.

Peace

slidingsky

Exactly, D1 style drifting has NO function. Its is all for show. Race and rally drifting are purposeful. Watch a drift tournament and tell me thats functional. They are sliding before the turn when you should be braking. FC drifter you should loosen up with kids. You didnt know everything when you started driving. Some guys just start with the wrong info, help them out if they still are dicks then them to try drifting aaround a bunch of pylons in a covered garage. They will probally hit one =). Rember we all start somewhere just some of use have better resources, like this forum.

FC Drifter

you guys still arent getting my point. the drift style fad has started, i have seen it in places other than here. ive seen two different kinds of drift newbies. those that are actualy seriously interested in drifting because they like it and those that just think it looks cool and are trying to be hip and trendy by doing it. i said it earlier, any of these little ricer/poser drift wannabes who are just trying to hop on the drift bandwagon and be cool will get nothing from me. but those that are serious and are really interested in the driving techniques and actually want to learn how to do it properly will get all the help they need from me. i dont mind helping people if they are worth the effort. im sure i sound like the biggest ******* for this, but i wont help these little posers out there, i refuse to, they arent worth the effort.

HIMNI Racing

What? ok. what are we talking about here? This post is getting ...................