Snrub

iTrader: (1)

I'm just curious, is anyone aware of any after market TII ECUs that would increase performance without increasing boost? ie. Something that would be equally as safe as the stock but perhaps have different fuel mappings? Could such a ECU also increase fuel economy?

I recall something a while back about MD racing ECUs, but their web site only has one variety advertised and there was some negative feedback.

RETed

No.
No.
No.

The whole points of upgrades is to increase boost.&nbsp Opening the exhaust will automatically give you most boost.


-Ted

Scott 89t2

I bet a tuned haltech on a stock motor would produce more power at same boost. better fuel and timing maping.

it would be the least power for the $$ and pointless by itself but he asked could it be done.

you could tune it for better gas mileage too but I think your power would go down.

adamlewis

I second that

RETed

The guy's asking questions like this, and you're going to trust him with a Haltect?




-Ted

Scott 89t2

well if he goes and buys a haltech after I tell him it's a waste of money then I'm sure he can afford a new engine too

yes go buy a haltech from www.k2rd.com it'll give you more power on a stock car.

(can I have my 10% now??)


maybe I can answer no to this then...
"Something that would be equally as safe as the stock"

Snrub

iTrader: (1)

Well that's some pretty receptive response. Let me put it this way, I'm not interested in a boost increase because I cannot afford the cost of the consequences. I realize that increasing the boost is an easy and a good way to get more performance, but you must admit there can be consequences. (perhaps pretty minor, but somewhat proportional to the boost increase)

MAZMAN

if your worried about consequences,then you shoudnt be playing with the motor at all...
leave it stock.Your asking for more power,but worried about fuel economy,drivability,reliable..ect....,it doesnt work that way.

RETed

Agreed with MAZMAN - you're asking to have your cake and eat it too.&nbsp This is not possible short of having a very EXPENSIVE and COMPLEX system to retrofit onto your existing engine just so you can keep the 5.5psi (1986-1988 Zenki) or 7.5psi (1989-1991 Kouki) turbo - we're talking plumbing an aftermarket wastegate just to keep the boost down.

Superchips used to market their reprogrammed ECU and claimed 255hp!&nbsp Guess what they included in their reprogrammed ECU?&nbsp A boost control bleeder valve - so this increases boost.

Yes, if tuned right, a stock boost FC can produce a little more power due to efficiency and by leaning fuel maps and advancing ignition to the ragged edge - this is just s bad if not worst that overboosting!

You're got the right idea, but you thinking is a bit twisted.&nbsp You can raise boost safely by having enough fuel to support those boost levels.&nbsp A Walbro 255lph upgrade fuel pump for a little over $100 is a "cheap" and relatively easy mod almost anyone can do to support up to 12psi of boost.

If you're worried about extra wear and tear from the added boost, you really shouldn't be messing with a turbo engine in the first place...




-Ted

Snrub

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for the replies. I realized it was semi-unrealistic, but that's why I phrased the post as a question of existance rather than where I could get one.

Since we've got that answered, is it possible to get an ECU that would increase the boost by a conservative amount? Bringing a '87 up to say 8psi? If this exists, how much more risk would one be looking at?

Evil Aviator

The price of fuel must be terribly high in Canada if you are considering spending $1,500 - $3,000 CAN on an ECU just to get better gas mileage.

TBoost

Well, its a little more complicated than that. If you change the exhaust and intake (which are the first steps in performance), you'll automatically overcome the wastegates' spring of 5.5psi and will yield a manifold pressure of 9-10psi in the higher gears (3rd on up). This can be dangerous if you add a boost controller as it would creep higher than that...

Adding an ECU for fuel is the best bet (coupled with an upgraded fuel pump).

Btw, Ted, you can also use a 3rd gen fuel pump other than a Walbro that would be satisfying up to 300RWHP (and its cheap used, too).

-M

Bean

ok then you don't need to be owning a turbo car dude...
the whole advantage of a turbo car in the performance world is your ability to get insane performance out of the car because of the turbo...

if you do it right you'll be fine...

oh yeah, the haltech would be increasing performance because of the removal of the MAF... other than that... there won't be much of an increase stock...

Snrub

iTrader: (1)

I was thinking that would be a nice addition to performance. There's no way I'd spend that kind of money on it...Anyway, since you've sort of asked, gas is more expensive than it should be, exactly 50% of our cost is tax. Lately it's been $.61-.69/L. That's about $.43 USD/L or about $1.94/gal USD. You guys pay ~$1.50? The poor bastards out east, especially in newfoundland can pay as much as $.15/L CDN more than us.

Snrub

iTrader: (1)

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Bean
[B]

ok then you don't need to be owning a turbo car dude...
the whole advantage of a turbo car in the performance world is your ability to get insane performance out of the car because of the turbo...

Can you not see how someone might want a car with power but not such a ridiculous amount that it compromises the practical aspects of the car? Anyway...for the money, the stock TII is the faster car out there. I'm just not in a position right now that I can own a ridiculous car, not to mention I'm not particularly mechanically experienced (shocking I know).

TBoost

I can almost guarantee you that its not just removing the MAF that would yield a big increase in performance.

Adjusting the fuel curve for maximum power alone would probably yield 18HP or more. In one of the recent issues of Turbo Magazine, they did this test with just an Apexi PFC on a Honda? And it yielded a 16HP increase throughout the entire rpm band with NO other adjustments(and 22lbs/ft torque).

-M

Dyre

I wish!

relvinnian

You guys can be real ****** ******** sometimes. Snrub may not be very knowledgable, but instead of ripping him apart word for word, why not try to get a general idea of what he's talking about? I garauntee he isn't that ****** stupid, that he'll pay 3k for a few extra mpg, or km/l. I think he just wants to squeeze a little extra performance out of his car, without sacrificing alot of realibility and/or practicality. Why not try to help a guy out?

-Brian

RETed

That's really iffy...

http://www.vfaq.com/RX7pump.html

Look at the bottom graph - the Walbro fuel pump is a little over $100.&nbsp Sure, it's a few dollars more than a used FD fuel pump, but I would rather have the extra fuel there.

One last thing, trying to get this FD fuel pump to work with a 1986-1988 Zenki FC is not a drop-in install.&nbsp The Walbro GSS341 is a much easier install on the early FC's.



-Ted

RETed

There are several facts you might not be aware of:

1) The stock ECU can support up to 15psi of boost.

2) You need a fuel-cut defensor (FCD) to prevent overboost fuel-cut when raising boost.&nbsp The more expensive option is to get the stock ECU reprogrammed to eliminate this overboost fuel-cut code in the program.

3) By replacing the stock intake and exhaust, you're letting the engine breathe a lot more efficiently.&nbsp By design, this also raises boost levels.&nbsp So technically, you don't need to reprogram the stock ECU to raise boost.

4) The early 1986-1988 Zenki FC's do not use the ECU to control boost.&nbsp Trying to reprogram the stock ECU on these early FC's for more boost is a waste of time.

You seem a bit lost on what you want to do.&nbsp I think you're thinking a bit too hard to what you want to actually do.&nbsp The car will take 10-12psi of boost with very little detriment to actual wear&tear.&nbsp The key to such elevated boost is a fuel system to support those boost levels; once the fuel system can support such boost, the engine will be happy.

Now, the bad sides, if youre motor is around or over 100k miles, the apex seals are probably worn past it's factory usable spec.&nbsp There is nothing you can do to fix this short of a rebuild - rebuilds are going to cost you in the neighborhood of $2,000.&nbsp I doubt you can afford such "luxuries".&nbsp You have every right to be worried about longevity, but you sound a more on the paranoid side at this point.&nbsp Even with this, the motor will still support 10-12psi of boost when done properly (i.e. fuel support).



-Ted

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

heres my .02
1. the fd pump went right into my 88 turbo2
2. we are paying 2.09usd per gallon
3. i think if i was going to do my car over i would have done it more mild (and smog legal) it would have been cheaper and the car would have been esier to live with day to day, which is the reason i got it in the first place. fc's are big and confortable, they are easy to live with stock, mine is a bit too much just to go to work (its fast though)

mike

RETed

Hmmm...I'd be curious to know how you managed that?

Isn't your '88 have a straight pipe to rubber hose to fuel pump, all held in with clamps?&nbsp Doesn't the Fd fuel pump have the fitting with an o-ring on top?&nbsp How did you manage to make it all fit?



-Ted

DRHP

Hey Ted,

Jose and I put in my FD pump like 4 years ago. I don't remember the details of it but it took about 10 minutes. I've also swapped my FD pump on the side of the road before in like 5 minutes. If I recall it was a hose with the 2 clamps and attach 2 wires. Now I don't know if there was a difference with the 89-91 pumps...

I could break out the digicam and snap some shots but I'm too lazy

Someone on the FC3S list also had problems with this. Maybe all FD pumps aren't the same?

-Ed

j9fd3s

iTrader: (3)

you have to take this little plastic framus off the pump and then it looks, feels, smells (and tastes) like the fc pump. i know its not as good as the walbro but hey it was free...

mike