dubulup

GtoRx7 - very cool car, love what you've done. What's the compression of your rotors? 310rwhp in N/A form must be a blast to drive!!

Nihilanthic - what is your point of staying around here???

Mahjik

iTrader: (1)

GtoRx7,

Damn nice. If I ever wanted a 3-rotor swap, what you did is exactly what I would want. Congrats on the car.

vspecpgt

actually i don't see the drifting judges as being biased. there are many different types of cars that drift, and 90 percent of them are 240 sx's. but i've also seen mustangs, miata's, rx7's, gto's etc.

last week there was an awesome car, it was a 240 hatch with an old firebird front end, big fire bird on the hood, and gold mesh wheels, think smoky and the bandit. drifting guys aren't about flashy-flashy crap and big wings, they are for the most part about having a good drivetrain in a crappy looking car. only the really good guys have a nice car, because the chances of them messing up and ruining it are far less.

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

I am using the 9.7:1 compression rotors, and thanks for the compliments! Its pretty entertaining, heal toe trail braking from 120 going into a on-ramp, then just powering out of it to feel the rear end start to point you perfectly to the exit, as you pass the merge traffic by 30mph. ( I try to keep it on the track, but its really hard to resist)

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

Thanks for the support, it means alot to me!

jack_arss

weird, my friend (fedor drives an orange'ish 240) was just telling me about an all motor 20b fd he saw at an event in ohio, then i stumble across it same day.

I dont really know what to say about the car, hasnt been said already, so WELL DONE.

BLUE TII

iTrader: (9)

What the hell happened to this thread?

Don't worry GtoRx7, most of us get why this is such a great conversion!

I have been thinking more about the whole combi port thing. In an NA intake port/runner velocity is very important to combat intake reversion for low end power.

It would seem best to me to run the P-port as a primary (as I have previously proposed) so it is fighting the unavoidable reversion from P-port. Then stage one side port to open and then the next sideport to open at a higher rpm.

Though both the primary and 2ndary the sideports (presumably) have the same port duration by opening one before the next you are able to maximize velocity in the ports/runners. If you open both at once the rotor has to suck in all the volume of the ports/runners before it even starts initiating velocity in the air columns.

So, dyno 1st with just the P-port primaries. Then dyno with P-ports and one sideport open per rotor. Then dyno with all ports open. Compare the dyno plots to see at which point the ports should be staged to maximize power for RPM.

I am interested to see how it all works out as I have also been leaning toward a NA 3 rotor over a 2 rotor turbo for reliability.

I have heard of streetport 20Bs doing 360hp at the wheel and P-port 20Bs doing 460hp at the wheel- it will be interesting to see where your combi port ends up!

rarson

YOU are the one who started it. This is the 20b forum, not the Other Engines forum. YOU busted in here talking **** and posting dynos of cars that have nothing to do with this thread. So if you don't like the responses we're giving, none of us will miss you if you see your *** out of this thread.

By the way, how many times are you going to post someone else's dyno results? "The only problems I've seen so far," HA HA HA! Like you've ever modified one.

This is not "planning before building," it's bench racing. "I'll have X parts and Y horsepower on Z engine running XXX times." BENCH RACING. Like the majority of other bench racers, your car will probably never materialize. Notice how GtoRx7 waited til AFTER his car was done to write about it, and til AFTER he had dynoed it to post numbers.

By the way, you don't get it. Nobody cares how cheaply fast you can go. Anyone can make a cheap fast car. No matter what you do, someone will make a faster car that is cheaper. Nobody who has posted in this thread besides you has cared how much the car cost to build. I guess when you have enough money to do things right, you don't focus on the cost so much.

Sure, whatever. Obviously you've never seen any local competitions. A lot of guys don't even have permanent bumper attachments on their cars, for the very reason it's a good chance they'll knock it off. Face it, the reason you don't like drifting is because you're too ***** to put your car out there because you know you'll hit the wall (oh wait, that's assuming you actually HAVE a running car).

I think the subjectivity of drifting is the best thing about it. The subjectivity allows people with AE86's to compete with people who have 550 whp FD's.

Look, Nihilanthic, nobody cares about the 2.3 in this thread, otherwise they'd be in that other thread. Just take your head out of your ***, do the smart thing, and don't bother posting in this thread anymore. You didn't address anything from my last post so I'm assuming this one will be the same.

mikespeed95

my s/n is mikespeed95 everywhere, we have this sweet little thing that shows anyone linking our site and when people click it, thus how i foudn this thread.

http://www.web-stat.com/prog_list_re...ift-crpw-.html


kanji stickers? you mean sponsors? wtf is kanji anyways? who doesnt want a flashy car for drifting? its about going crazy?

show me some consistent "Subjective judging" and back it up with video. they make bad calls every once in a while like any judge/referee, but calling it subjective is a lie, and i would like you to back up your claim.






also to whoever asked, the 2.3L ford engine is a sohc 4 banger found in the SVO mustangs / turbo t-birds and is basically teh same engine found in the pinto / escort / ranger.

onefastrx7turbo

iTrader: (5)

single over head cam engine owns joo!!! hahahaha gay. nice project so far GTO!!! I cant wait to see some video of it running!! are you going to sevenstock?


Neil

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

I want to go this year, last year was a BLAST!! I will see how the schedule falls down for me, I might make it. I have some vids on here, but the thread is getting kinda long to read all of it, I think its on page 3-4? I have it on the dyno, and just messing around in a rained lot, quick highway run. I am posting some more after I go to practice on thursday, so you can see how its running now( much smoother and finely tuned) for all to see! I video is worth a million words. Thanks again for the props.

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

I know Fedor, we have hung out a few times after events. Weird he didnt remember my name (Logan) ? He also knows Peter, and Tadashi, my good friends on our drift team.

Nihilanthic

Damn, I got everyone riled up. Whoops.

Anyway, drifting DOES, yeah, take skill, but all the Kanji (the non-phonetic japanese writing symbols) all over everything, giant wings, and gaudy paint jobs arent exactly attractive. But at any rate looking RIDICULOUS is what drifitng is. Being as flashy and gaudy as possible and hanging your *** out around turns. I'll admit getting a mullet and an el-camino is pretty original, and funny, but its still ridiculous. Yanno what else, youre probably a much better drifter than me, becuase I havent tried and dont WANT to try. Its flashy and crowd pleasing, but not being interested in it or being one of the entertained spectators, it does zip.**** for me.

Im not even going to do more to address Kumho Redsmoke tires than to say they exist.

Oh, and I see people are going after the alphabet soup bullshit about SOHC > DOHC, or "guilt by association" as to how a NA 2.3 is sooooo comparable to a 2.3 Turbo. By your own logic, rotaries suck because they used rotaries in lawnmower engines. BTW - you have a mullet and drift an EL CAMINO! Hey I can make stupid comments about apperances and image too!

Well, obviously having looked at flow in CFM for the stock 2.3 ported or the D-port heads, and the esslinger aluminum ones, I can say that.... THEY WORK FINE! But regardless Im not building an N/A motor so I dont need much in the way of porting, big valves or a cam. If I was going to, I could, but If I was going N/A Id go with more displacement... sound familiar? But hey, we all need our alpha-bits, right? yeah... get a honda DOHC VTEC, or put a HKS SSQBOV on any car with a turbo, and call the car a FC3S, or get an erection from the number of valves the head uses...

But anyway, if anyone can tell me how to get this or any of those dynos I've shown that are anything BUT expensive/trick motors, out of a 13b, without spending more than a few grand, I'll do it. Until then, I'll be more than happy to use a 'pinto engine' and whoop everyones ***, just like you do with a 'lawnmower engine', right?

Oh and before I finish, lemme save you the trouble of how to flame back, just give me the #'s:

1. make fun of the engine having only one cam and 8 valves as if that variable matters more than the CFM flow (if youre looking at the valves) because EVERYONE really cares about that more than air flow and power production!
2. say its a pinto engine!
3. jab at the lack of disposable income I have, ignorant of the fact that not everyone has or wants that much to blow in a car and some LIKE cheap projects, and think more money = more better. Oh and dont forget that someone whose 20 and going to college is really hurt by being told he doesnt have a lot of spending money.
4. call me stupid, please.
5. Say Im gonna **** up a chassis brought on a trailer from the dock to the dealership by the Budweiser clydesdales and a magical unicorn at the front bearing two rotors about its horn while little elves carry the housings and e-shaft, etc by putting a inferior/piston/pinto/whatever motor in it
6. any sort of ad-hominem attack I've neglected to enumerate.
7. bitch about me planning and looking at results I can EXPECT before spending money vs doing it, and not knowing, and finding that a 'fun', 'challenge'!
8. (almost forgot) bring up WEIGHT DISTRIBUTION/handling

But yeah, Im done. I'll come back with a dyno, time slip, a list of prices + tax for everyone, and maybe even $8 for bubba to go to greatclips at the end of it all.

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

I fabbed up some cool (cool to me) new items to the FD, to add to its drivabily. Like a mechanical cruise control (weighs a 1/4 pound), and a non-performance robbing exhaust silencer (driver operated). The only reason for adding them is for the 13 hour drive I have to take this weekend, but it will be nice on a day to day drive as well. I will post some pic tommorrow. I know, its not performance stuff, but hey, I do what I can with what I got! Later

onefastrx7turbo

iTrader: (5)

I dont understand why you are here?! if you dont like rotaries...then go to the redneck "holley double pumper" forums and tell them how slow and gay rotaries are. I doubt anyone will miss you here. You say that they used rotaries in lawnmowers? yea? so? they used them in snowmobiles too. So what. They use and still use PISTON engines in them now. I don't see your point. just go put your ancient technology ford 2.3 liter engine in your FC then get walked on by us later. it'll be fun. 20B turbo owns joo....


neil

r0gu3

I'm just wondering when you are going to head over to Jimlab's thread and start bashing that?

GtoRx7

iTrader: (5)

From now on I think we should simply IGNORE any posts made by Nihanthic, or even acknowledge he exists. Even if he pokes fun, or simply is a idiot. Starting...now.

CCarlisi

What we need to forget about all this is another video Great project!

Nihilanthic

Im not a rotary HATER I simply dont like how pricey they are to get, mantain, modify, and that theyre so sensitive to knock.

The lawnmower comment is due to "zomg 2.3 iz a pinto motor" type crap I've heard. Maybe I should call the car the pinto-experiment 7.

As far as being walked on, duh there are ways to make MUCH more power. Im trying to make CHEAP power here, not as much as I can. If I was I'd go find a 350 4 bolt main block, build it up as a forged 400+ cid motor, get some AFR heads and rig up some mongo turbo and then go get a built automatic w/ a slip stall converter and a C4 rear end. As far as fuel management Id either go standalone or just build a box around a carb that can flow enough to match the power it would make, and well do the obvious plumbing required.

I'm shooting for cheap, reliable 300-400 whp out of a cheap engine with an aftermarket that isnt expensive that also happens to be the same powerplant a friend of mine is using who already has experimence with them.

This isnt meant to be pistons vs rotaries, its "how can I cheaply get a 300-400 hp light weight good handling car that doesnt suck" and AFAIK 13BTs are pricey and hate knocking... isnt that an accepted fact of life if you like rotaries?

BTW - rotaries were developed in what, the 50s? 60s? The 2.3 started off in the 70s.. sooo ancient. But either way, how 'old' something is doesnt really matter, especially considering that DOHC was around a LONG time ago, just not in common use. Snob appeal of being on the cutting edge and having tons of easy to market acronyms doesnt matter, power/weight and how useable the powerband is. Simplicity is a sophistication itself - isnt that why people like how rotaries have so few moving parts, no valves, etc?

But yeah, I'm done with this thread until its built and I have purty pictures and pricelists and ****, then Its off to get a competition liscense and walk the talk.

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

Geez.. not another pistonhead thinking pistons better than Rotaries. Come on!! why are you even here?? Rotary owners are diehard, dedicated owners. Obviously you aren't one, so stop the preaching and go pray to Piston Gods or something. We don't need to be 'SAVED'.... I have a piston engine car that I drive daily that I don't give a **** about. GEEZ!!

Herblenny

iTrader: (13)

WHAT?? YOU must be kiddin?? So now you are generalizing all rotaries and specifying your 2.3 pistons?? How about when was the pistons developed??

How about 20Bs?? Do you know when they were produced??

shm21284

So, logan, whats up? I want to ride in your 20b again, possibly fly through some on ramps too see its gripping power... its been so long since I had a good grip ride.

rarson

It's funny, because everytime you post in response to other people's posts, you never address mine. Since you haven't left the thread yet, I have to assume it's because you didn't read them.

I believe you were the first one to talk about a naturally-aspirated 2.3, when you went off a tangent on what you could do (although from your own self-admitted fact that you don't have enough money it's obvious you couldn't do it). I also think you missed the point about the SOHC comments. It's not that the head is SOHC, it's that it's an 8-valve head. If you know anything about fluid dynamics, then I don't need to explain this.

NO, you CAN'T. See, this is bench racing! Nobody cares what information you pulled off of some other forum!

Let's assume you ported the **** out of your 8-valve head. How is the drivablility now, with your "biggish" turbo (which I'm going to assume is a T78 since you never answered my question)? Oh that's right, you wouldn't know because you have no experience with any of these mods. And "experience" doesn't mean "blowing **** up." I have plenty of experiences with many engines, and guess what, I've never blown any of them.

What decade are you living in, 1975? Do you know anything about tuning turbocharged vehicles???

You're posting someone else's dyno numbers again? That is also bench racing, not so much the fact that you're sharing information with everyone, but for the fact that no one asked for it and you are using it as proof of superiority of your completely hypothetical and currently non-existant engine. See, the thing is, plenty of people can look at dyno charts with a certain combination and copy it. But a lot of people who throw parts at a car, like you are so apt to do, wind up never coming close to those numbers. So I am sure your car will never make anywhere near those numbers with the same combination, because you're tuning it yourself. Don't tell me that you're going to talk all about your cheap method and then pay hundreds of dollars to have someone else tune your engine for you!

Once again, this is bench racing. And once again, no one asked you for it. No one cares how much you spend on your car! For someone so sensitive about people picking on you, you sure sling the comments out to everyone else.

Look, the 2.3L engine is a good engine. It's been proven to make great horsepower. If you want to use it to make your car fast on the cheap, GREAT! But this ISN'T the thread to talk about it and we DON'T need you ****-talking because YOU think that he paid too much.

Instead of worrying about what people say about you in this thread (because we really won't say another thing provided you just leave the thread) and wasting your time TALKING about the car, why don't you just go ahead and build it already? I would love to see it materialize, but NOT in this thread. Start your own thread in the Other Engines forum once it's done and I will surely check it out. If it's good then I will give you the respect you're due. But if you continue to just troll this thread and bench race, then I'm just going to keep taking huge ***** on you.

NOPR

tomorrow night... hopefully.

touch_my_wankel

....damn. rarson, u totally got **** on him.

im a noob to rotaries but i like em. i was deff into the conventional engines b4, but who puts a piston engine in a rotary powered car? just get one of a million other cars that has a piston engine already in it and swap that engine with an even bigger one if u want to do an engine swap. that just doesnt make sense to me y sum 1 would go from rotary to piston.

as for conventional engines being less expensive to mod than rotaries, i think thats not quite right. there are less thingd that can be changed on a rotary but they cost more whereas the piston engines have more moving parts and more mods, which if u add up a bunch of little numbers, they eventually get to make a pretty big bill.