krackerx7

iTrader: (1)

I have to much time on my hands your posts 14,561 my posts 386
Man YOU must alot of time on your hands

I was thinking renesis rotors for the compression. I havnt seen to much information about that setup on 20b's, If you would like to show me some links to some information, I would glady educate myself.(not saying its not out there, I just havent read it)

pretty much to do something thats never been done/to be differnt and i was thinking twin charging for the fact you would have the off idle power of a roots style charger with a clutch drive and a airbypass then when the big turbo gets spooled up the system runs off the turbo. yes it would be a major major undertaking with time and money but hey we can dream cant we, oh wait no no i cant otherwise i'll get flamed

sorry just thinking out loud. i'll make sure to keep my thoughts to my self next time. sorry about that.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Hmm, tell you what. If you can get yourself a 20B, we'll shut up.

krackerx7

iTrader: (1)

what does that have to do with anything?

t-von

iTrader: (8)

You might have to get use to the way some people reply around here. Some of the info is helpfull, but the majority of the replys are people criticizing other peoples ideas.

RETed

I meant you just sit there and think about building an "ultimate" (20B) rotary.
Personally, I like to do **** myself.
I've done the 20B with the stock twin turbos and with no turbos - have you?



Stock 20B compression is 9.0:1.
RX-8 rotors are 10:1.
There is info on using RX-8 rotors in 13B engines - try searching for the info.
I haven't heard of anyone using RX-8 rotors in a 20B - why not put your money where your mouth is and do the R&D for us for this particular question?


Dream? Sure.
Talking about a pipe dream without getting the motor first?
Of course be prepared to get flamed...
BTW, I'm not flaming you...I'm asking you to put your money where your mouth is before asking such questions.
I'd like to see pics of your 20B before we go further in this discussion - that's all.


I hope so.


-Ted

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Wow this thread is getting rediculious. krackerx7 it's odvious your not going to get any help in this thread. I suggest you look over at Nopistons.com or maybe Ausrotary.com for help with your questions. They tend to be more helpfull. Lets not forget everyone! We were all newbs at one point and totally clueless. Give the guy a break!

t-von

iTrader: (8)

Ted so does that mean WE ALL have to show pics anytime WE ALL have dreams or ideas relating to 20b's? I would understand your comment better if the guy was paying you for the info that he's trying to get. This is in-fact a free public forum.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Heh, if somebody was paying me for my info, I'd write a friggin book!

krackerx7

iTrader: (1)

this is getting out of hand, I never said I was going to build anything if you look at my original post i said "I would like to build a NA 20b in the FUTURE: never saying i have one or was in the process of getting one, and about the twin charging like i said in my original post that "since im dreaming why dont we twin charge a 20b". And yes at work i have plenty of time to think about this sorta stuff and other things, wouldnt it be fun to do this or put this motor into this and things like that.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

Why not go with triple turbos then? That's be a real dreamy setup. Also if you're going to the trouble of getting Renesis rotors, which will definitely need to be milled for the taller apex seals used with peripheral exhaust port rotor housings, as used in the 20B, why not go with Ianetti ceramic apex seals? You're going to save up plenty of money in order to do this project right in the future, so why not dream big if you're planning on spending big?

Hmm, what are some other nice but expensive items? How about Motec engine management? How are ATC clutches at holding up to lots of torque? Any good?

RETed

No, but I don't think you're stupid enough to ask us about running 10:1 CR rotors from an RX-8 or bother with twin charging the 20B...

RIGHT?


-Ted

RETed

Look, we've all been there, but some of us more experienced folk know you're very inexperienced in this particular area.

You might think you're asking perfectly valid questions, but anyone experienced with a 20B will roll their eyes.

THERE IS NOTHING WRONG WITH ASKING YOUR QUESTIONS.
I NEVER SAID YOU WERE WRONG.
I NEVER SAID YOU CAN'T DO IT.

I find it VERY UNLIKELY you will ever do this - so prove me wrong?

Running higher compression ratio rotors is a royal waste of time.
9:0 rotors have been proven to work on very high powered 13B's and 20B's.
I don't see any significant advantage to running 10:1 rotors, ESPECIALLY WHEN RUNNING FORCED INDUCTION, which you clearly note.
Higher compression decreases the safety buffer with boost.
Maybe you should look at the Mazdatrix first-hand experience with running the 10:1 RX-8 rotors in their 13B NA motor - they actually LOSS power.
Yes, the 10:1 and lighter rotors might give you slightly better response down low, but when we're talking about a 500+ 20B, I doubt you can tell the difference.
I can see running non-turbo or very low boost (under 10psi), but that's a royal waste of a 20B in my book.

Twin charging is the big hype HKS did for the 4AGZE.
Anyone who hears about this...thinks it's a great idea.
Sure, it'll spool faster, but WTF do you need it on a 500+hp 20B?
Sure, it might be nice on something 200...300hp.
On **** making 400+ on a 3000lbs. chassis, it's a royal waste of time.
Yes, you will get your uuuuuuh's and aaaaaaaah's when you pop the hood - aka magazine show car - but have you ever heard of K.I.S.S.?

Let me ask you...
How much power does your car make?
What kinda car do you own?
What is the more powerful car have you owned?

I have this funny feeling you've never felt anything over 300hp...


-Ted

krackerx7

iTrader: (1)

my car is the fastest car ive driven im getting it dyno tuned soon so i dont know exact numbers.

ps. when idid say twin charging i didnt mean in the sense of using rensis rotors for that.
also i have always held you and jeff20b in high regard for your knowledge

t-von

iTrader: (8)

It's about doing what you want with your money regardless if it's necessary or not. Some people just want to do something thats a little bit differant. There was a guy at sevenstock that custom built a twin 13b rear engine racing car. I don't think anyone will tell him he's stupid. He had the money, he did what he wanted to. I think a higher compression 20b with a custom twin ball bearing turbo set-up would be the ****. You would have immidiate throttle response and power all the way to red line with lower boost. Sure your safety buffer with boost is lowered but, thats what water injection/race gas is for. Ted you know it's all about the tuning.

Node

iTrader: (1)

I've heard of a 20b w/ rx-8 rotors. It was p-port though

He gained 20hp by going from high compression s5 rotors to rx-8 rotors.

You have to mill the apex seal slots. I don't remember in which way though.

Jeff20B

iTrader: (13)

It's easy. Just mill them as deep as any S6 or earlier rotor.

Node

iTrader: (1)

man i need you guys to mill out my rotors for those new 4.5mm seals. theyre all the rage man.....they say i can run toiletwater and like 42 pounds of boost man


after i get my new tremec t56 turbo with a 3.1612 A/R F trim, im gonna run a metric ton y0!

Rotary20B

I'm building a N/A 20B at the moment for my S3 RX-7.

Just wondering what you guys have done in terms of a tacho? Can the original be modified & used at all?

RETed

Stock FC tach will do it, but you need to crank the adjustment screw all the way over.

We currently use a single DIS-4 to run three channels of ignition into a trio of twin tower coils.
The MSD DIS-4 has a tach output that goes straight into the tach lead into the stock FC tach instrument cluster.


-Ted