At my racetrack i am required to run straight water for coolent....meaning no antifreese. Do i need to make any modifications to run straight water or can i just flush and fill good to go??

Also would this make my car run any hotter?

 

This is BAD for Rotaries. You should use 50/50 Mix, with DISTILLED water, and some Redline Water-Wetter.

The cooling system needs the lubrication of the coolant.
After time your coolant passanges look like **** without it.

I guess you could run straight water for the event only, and then swap back. FLush and fill should be good to go.


You sure they aren't just requiring an overflow bottle?

 

Straight water, use Redline Water wetter. The water wetter provides lubrication for the water pump bearing/seal and removes the surface tension of the water so it cools BETTER... You will notice no temp increase with the straight water...

Coolant actually does NOT improve water's ability of cooling... It raises the boiling point and lowers the freeze point. But a stock radiator cap should keep the boiling point of water well above 235 deg Farenheit... That's as hot as the engine should get anyhow.

 

The problem with running straight water is not "lubrication" so much as water is an excellent solvent that is pretty corrosive.

Galvanic Corrosion is the main problem. It's a type of corrosion that you get when two dissimilar metals are in direct contact with each other or are communicating with the same water. What is a rotary engine - a big fat stack of aluminum and iron. Recipe for galvanic corrosion if there ever was one! (And then there's the COPPER radiator)

Straight water will eat the aluminum like you wouldn't believe. US automakers discovered the problem in the 60's when aluminum water pumps/timing covers were going into wider use... note that Ford went back to iron water pumps for a *loong* time.

Coolant (antifreeze) has anti-corrosive additives built in. So does, I believe, Water Wetter. Straight water in any engine with aluminum contacting the cooling system is a severe no-no - you *must* have anticorrosives in there.

edit: Distilled water is also a big no-no for cooling systems. Remember water is one of the best solvents in the world. It will do its hardest to dissolve the aluminum and iron from the engine. Distilled water makes it "hungrier" as it "eats" away the engine that much faster until it meets its equilibrium. Might as well just use straight tap water, which is more-or-less sated in its appetite for metals from the pipes it gets transported through. Look at it this way: Either the water carries in its own minerals, or it takes them by force from your engine. (DEIONIZED water might be a better bet, as it is much less reactive)

 

yea as long as you use water wetter you should be fine, I ran my car for the last few weeks with just water because I was doing some work and didn't feel like wasting coolant everytime I had to drain it. Why do they prohibit coolant? Is it in the case of a spill?

 

Glycol-based coolants are slippery as hell, don't evaporate easily like water, yet don't get absorbed by kitty litter-type products easily like oil.

I've heard that Water Wetter actually makes water less slick... but in any event it'd be FAR less hazardous to drive on/difficult to clean up than glycol-based stuff.

 

Is it alright to use 50/50 water/coolant with no water wetter?

 

I was confused about the Distilled/Deionized water thing. I honestly don't remember anymore.

 

Yeah, that's what most people use.

I run premixed 50/50 from the local autoparts store. Yeah, I know, I'm paying for half of it being water, but the difference is that the water has been demineralized and deionized, meaning that it won't form deposits in my coolant passageways and it won't eat away at my engine from the inside (as much). Besides, it's not that much more expensive than buying antifreeze and mixing it myself, and makes it easier to top up.

Jon

 

Well, you learn something everyday. This is a great thread.

 

That's exactly what I do, based on the same rationale.

 

It's also what truck engine manufacturers recommend. You use the specified coolant, which is already at the proper dilution, with "good" water. (The "un-mixed" coolant is still mostly water, just not as dilute as it needs to be)

Too bad I can only find it in one-quart "top up" containers at the auto parts stores. It's a fine idea, and one that is long overdue.

But this really has nothing to do with the original issue: using straight water in an engine.

You can do it for short periods of time - heck I have used Pepsi, iced tea, and windshield washer fluid in order to get home, and then left it in there for days afterwards out of sheer laziness. Just don't use water exclusively for long periods of time, unless engine longevity is not a concern for you. (for instance, if you're popping engines every other event, pure water is probably the way to go, if only for the sheer economics )

 

What kind of racing? dirt or asphault

 

Thats funny

 

As long as it's a liquid of about the right viscosity it'll work fine as a coolant. When you're in a suburban wasteland and you just blew a coolant hose, you scavenge every source of water or water-like substance to get back home. After you figure out how to stop the leak, of course. Fortunately, the last time that happened to me I had not only a full washer solvent tank but also a full washer solvent bag in the back, in addition to half a gallon of tea. That is almost two gallons and more than enough to get back home.

Besides, Pepsi isn't worth drinking. I dunno how it even got into my car.

 

Glad to know you guys have done your homework, I've always just been happy to go for a 50/50 mix so I guess I've been treating my baby right.

 

So should i get the water wetter and put it in there and leave it or should i just drain the water after im done racing and then fill it up before i go next time?? I REALLY dont want to buy water wetter every time i go racing........in fact thats not an option for me right now. Im going to be asphault racing

 

I think the reason why the track suggest running water only is, it is hard to clean up if you drop some on the track. Coolant is harder to clean off the track then oil. Strait water is the best cooling liquid out there. Everything else increases the boiling point and water hates heat and trys to disapate it as much/soon as possible. I've never tried the water wetter stuff, to cheap, I could afford water and some preston cooling system lubrication and rust prevention stuff.
chuck

 

From Mazda Motorsports website:

Fluid
We recommend using a 90% water to 10% glycol mix. Water has superior heat transfer properties (2-1/2 times better) than glycol-based coolant products. Using distilled or purified water will reduce scale build-up.
It's important to remember to change back to a 50/50 water/glycol mix when storing the car, especially if you live in severe winter climates.

 

I attempted to use **** as coolant in my buddy's Plymouth Acclaim when it lost all the coolant, but no dice...

Filled it up and it disapeared... Pulled the dipstick and it was way past full... 2 gallons of coolant, 4 quarts of oil, and about half a gallon of passenger's ****. Head gasket blew.

We left the car on the Pennsylvania turnpike last summer where it died.

 

Hope you let the radiator filler opening cool off first to avoid getting a nasty burn. Ouch!

 

NASA specifically prohibits ethylene glycol-based coolant on the track - for the reasons mentioned above - someone always blows a hose or gets a rock through their radiator and dumps their cooling system on the track - on the line - in traffic. Plain water is a lot less slippery on asphalt. Most folks do run distilled water + Water Wetter in this situation. Interestingly, SCCA does not have this restriction. I don't know of any tracks that make this an issue, but I suppose they might.

I got my chemistry degree more than 20 years ago, so I may have forgotten or misremembered some of it, but I have to question some of peejay's post. Water is certainly a solvent. However, pure water will not dissolve metal (steel or aluminum) or rubber (your hoses and seals). Tap water contains a variety of dissolved minerals ("salts") which, over time, can precipitate out and contribute to the "scale" that clogs up your system. The more purified the water, the fewer salts, and the less this is a problem - and it doesn't matter if the purification method is steam distillation or reverse osmosis ("destilled" vs. "deionized" water). As far as the issue of galvanic corrosion is concerned, this is an issue any time two dissimilar metals are in electrical contact - and water definately conducts electricity well - no matter whether it is tap water or pure water. I believe the majority of "scale" in cooling systems is actually the result of galvanic corrosion and resultant precipitation of aluminum and iron salts. The corrosion inhibitors in commercial antifreeze and Water Wetter attempt to slow this process down, and keep these salts dissolved, rather than allowing them to precipitate. That's one of the reasons you need to change your coolant from time to time - it only has so much capacity to maintain these salts in solution.

As far as cooling effectiveness, Pele is right on! Ethylene glycol does not help cooling effectiveness - in fact, it hurts, though it's usually a minor issue, and for a street car that sees freezing temps, the trade-off is clearly worthwhile.

Bottom line - for maximal cooling, track safety, and adequate protection of your system from galvanic corrosion and scale buildup, distilled water + Water Wetter is ideal. However, if it won't protect your engine from freezing, so be sure to add ethylene glycol if your temps get down that low.

 

Use distilled or deionized water and water wetter and one of these:

http://www.jcwhitney.com/webapp/wcs/...0101&langId=-1

http://www.canadianmustang.com/s.mv?p=521105

 

That's a good idea.

 

Will i see any buildup using distilled water + water wetter if it is in there for say 5 months? (the racing season)