ATF, MMO, Witches tonic, Beer- Whatever it is, for Gawds sake, STOP telling people to pour this **** down their carbs when they can't get their engines started!
It's just plain BAD advice!
Doing the "ATF Treatment" by pouring in a TABLESPOON of ATF or (better yet-) MMO per rotor face works wonders on removing carbon deposits that tend to make for "sticky" side seals and apex seals.

Death-bed engines that show no desire to compress, or is siezed due to rust or carbon lock, ATF will both help seal things up a bit as well as free up the internals to help an engine start.

But when you HAVE NOT completed any diagnostic troubleshooting, you don't know what the hell's wrong with the damn thing! Time and time again I see people dulling out this poorly substantiated bad advice because, "...it worked fer me!", when in fact for that person, it might've been the two minutes waiting time the engine really needed while he was pouring **** down his carb!
The other thing that bothers me about this advice is that hardly anyone ever specifys how much to use! They just say, "...Pour some...". The kid could be using 1/2 quart and practically mixing up diesel in his engine!

Troubleshoot the problem first! The ATF or MMO 'treatment' is a cleaning operation in which the engine components need to soak in the **** for 24 hours or more.
Using ATF to mimic compression is not usually the answer to peoples "no-start" problems, and can make the situation more frustrating. An engine whos carb is doused in ATF does not try to start up like gangbusters. Instead, it dawgs like crazy, spewing out a toxic cloud that serves only to clog up your cold catalytic converters. The thin film of coke that will form from doing this repeatedly burns very hot, and can damage the cats. The honeycomb or perforated sleaves and baffels inside can then easily deteriorate, causing undue backpressure. This problem would only present itself at a later date as it takes time for it all to happen.

Check fuel delivery- both plumbing wise and electric wise.
Check carb breathing and sealing.
Check ignition.
Check that you have gas, but don't ever tell anyone if you did'nt.
Use a running car to jump it, which will insure a good spin of the rotors, and therefor a good "throw" of the apex seals. (Everyone seems to think they need to be radially spun to centrafuge them against the housings for a good seal to start. - I disagree, unless you've burnt the damn springs.)

Everybody wants the "magic solution" where they don't have to work for results!

 

here here!

 

Sorry .

[lame attempt to cover my own ***]But at least I linked to the page about it, so if they read it they should understand what it is and what it does, so they couldve figured out for themselves if it would work or not .[/lame attempt to cover my own ***]

~T.J.

 

Good points, they could even be extended to cover "don't post advice if you're more or less completely guessing and don't understand very well what you're talking about (without providing a disclaimer or some kind of reference to preceding facts)".

My favourite is the carb mixture screw adjustment, a miracle fix for all types of problems

 

sterling, i would put 3 gallons of atf in it, get a turkey baster and put about 3 tspns in the exhaust. also might want to put a bit in the radiator.

 

Only thing I see ATf good for is starting a rotary that has bad apexes thats it... I left a rotor in a bucket with ATf for a MONTH, and it didnt take **** off it

 

it wasn't the bucket i was always trying to clean my hands in was it?

 

I left a rotor in a bucket with ATF for a good few weeks, and it still took light sandpaper to get the **** off of it...

~T.J.

 

my mmo thread that faded fast had the interesting fact that mmo soaked into and break off carbon deposits as it burns in the combustion.

 

I'm sure heat was needed as a catalyst, Mike,,,,I don't think they claim it would just happen by exposing a metal surface to it....some mechanical effort is still required...sandpaper or combustion flame front...

And who the heck set sterling off this time??? Guy's like a maniac Jack-In-The Box popping up out of nowhere to club you in the head!!

 

dont forget the master cylinder resevour.... thats the KEY to getting it started. and pour some on top of the coils and distributor connections. oh and the gas tank.

hahahah im j/k but thats funny hell jeremy

 

Yeah usually you can see him coming but this, well this was a rare Sterling sneak attack. LOL

 

Nah pour it into the ign switch if its an ign problem.

 

damn 5 sec memory. must be all the late night drinking sesions. instead of atf use wild turkey. it'll get everything going in mass quantities except cap'n winky. oops, did i say that out loud? gotta go............

 

Are you saying hes an evil clown???????????

<runs and jumps for cover>

 

Ya got me rollin on floor with that one, Mario!

 

I put 3/4 quart of ATF in a junkyard motor for 48hrs that had leaky oil rings and therefore pleanty of carbon in the motor. Carbon came off in chunks, right out the exhaust ports. Worked for me to decarbonize!

The motor shortblock was sitting in my driveway so I could pull the carbon out the exhaust port with tweezers. Dry cranked it and got 95% ATF out of there. Only a small puff of smoke when she started.

* I do agree with Sterling that many things should be checked first before resorting to pouring ATF in de motor.* It's a last resort, really.

 

If someone's dumb enough to pour half a litre of oil down the carb then a non-starting engine is the least of their worries.

It's not just for carboned up engines either. If an engine has flooded pretty bad it washes away the film of oil coating the apex seals. Getting a bit oil in there helps it build up that initial compression to get it started.

 

hey i havent tried it yet im checkin fuel, spark, etc...
thanks for the link though RMD

 

well YEAH if you just soak a rotor in ATF it won't do crap, you need the combustion to burn the stuff off. That only comes from a running engine.
Thanks for the post Sterling, I've had several bad experiences with the stuff, because it can make an otherwise good engine hard as Hell to start. I only recommend it for preventive care.

 

I have had great experiences with MMO/ATF. I have brought back two different cars from the dead with it, both of which had been sitting for over 2 years without being started because the owners thought their motors were blown. One had even been to a local Mazda dealership for service where they had been informed they would need a new motor. 30,000 miles later, I think the ATF I put in the spark plug holes was definitely worth the investment. While I had been more leary of pouring MMO down the barrels of the carbs, I have found it to be a quick way to resolve a flooded engine on the spot and have used and seen it used successfully many times. If it works, it works. NO, it does not solve the problem of what is causing it to flood in the first place. However, it can be the difference between driving your car home or it riding on a flatbed. If I had not seen it work time and time again, then maybe I could abide by Sterling's request to not mention MMO/ATF in a thread when someone is having difficulty starting their engine. But if they have Air, Fuel, and Spark; then I know what will be the first words typed on my keyboard. Regardless of my great respect or Sterling and his Carb knowledge...

Just another point of view,
James

 

You may come from a different perspective with apparently much more experience using this stuff than me, but we do share a few points- which is great because I believe them to be the most important ones-

Use it for reviving old crusty engines where there is a gem of a rotary encased in a lump 'o **** that has'nt seen the 'light of performance' in some time.

And then, basically you say, "check everything else first" and then go ahead and use it.

Totally makes sense. I don't mean to put anyone down cause when you don't know, you just don't know! But newbes that get their paws on old rotaries often need regular good old fashioned automotive troubleshooting advice.

I stand by the fact that people that are having a hard time getting their rotary to start are suffering from frustration.
People on this board that don't offer to walk them through any troubleshooting and simply toss them a bone and call it a magic bullet without giving any specifics suffer from lazyassness.

 

True or not True? Still a rookie with rotaries to some degree but don't vacuum leaks create starting problems as well? I remember my then new to me '82 refused to start and was told by a rotary "god" to check vac. hoses. Found two that leaked replaced them, problem solved. Can anybody confirm or just call it beginers luck? Here again potentially valuable information while not a bottle of ATF or MMO or Wild Turkey gets harmed!

 

I know a guy that owns a car wash, I usually have him replace the soap drum with a 55 gal drum of MMO and I push non starting cars through.

For real though. You gotta diagnose the problem...

I used to have this LONG *** writeup on diagnosing no starts. The only required tools were either a multimeter or a test light. (Test lights are like $5) and one of those Wal*Mart socket sets that's like $20. (Always keep something like that in your car... Comes in way handy.) It was applicable to ANY gasoline engine. I'll retype is when I get home as it was posted long before the 2002 crash.

 

It wasn't me who told you that Hell yes a vacuum leak can affect how the car runs or starts.

I've used a small amount of ATF poured in through spark plug holes before to start old tired engines. It makes an impressive amount of smoke. I always used this as a last resort. Pulling a car down the street always gets it started and this is how we'd start it after the ATF was in it. I've never had an engine not start by pulling it down the street. I've had them so flooded that they wouldn't start after a week of sitting. Even got an engine with one very dead rotor to start up by pulling it down the street. The thing only ran over about 3000 rpm and even then had zero power but it started! Pulling may not be the best thing in the world for the car either but it always works and I definitely recommend it over just pouring something into the motor. I don't use the ATF method anymore.