Ranting
02-06-08, 10:19 AM
#1
Rota-lution
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Ranting
Screw the FB man. Well more like screw the carb i have. That thing has a personal vendetta towards me or something. I have tinkered with it for a month straight. Bought two carb kits for it. Bought new floats and it STILL doesn't run correctly.
It discourages me so much i am seriously thinking of just selling the whole car.
I am so ignorant right now as well so...**** YOU CAR. **** YOU CARB.
....excuse me if i offended you but !!! ...will it EVER run correctly??
It discourages me so much i am seriously thinking of just selling the whole car.
I am so ignorant right now as well so...**** YOU CAR. **** YOU CARB.
....excuse me if i offended you but !!! ...will it EVER run correctly??
02-06-08, 11:43 AM
#5
My 7 is my girlfriend.
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Not that I enjoy pushing my wares, but this thing is just collecting dust now. As stated it works just fine, it's only off the car because I bought a Sterling
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=725071
I don't know what you meant by not having the funds, but this is an option if your really not having any luck with your carb. Try PMing Sterling directly, he should be able to help you figure yours out.
https://www.rx7club.com/showthread.php?t=725071
I don't know what you meant by not having the funds, but this is an option if your really not having any luck with your carb. Try PMing Sterling directly, he should be able to help you figure yours out.
02-06-08, 12:06 PM
#6
djessence
Sterlings carb is definetly the way to go, save for a week or 2 and send him like 400 lol.
On the other hand if u r looking for advice, problems would help however i will offer a solution to the unknown problem......Check for vaccuum leaks.
And technically this should be in the non tech section LOL jk (but not rly)
or you could save up for a TII conversion and then you can say hello to efi but im pretty sure they have their own set of prblems
On the other hand if u r looking for advice, problems would help however i will offer a solution to the unknown problem......Check for vaccuum leaks.
And technically this should be in the non tech section LOL jk (but not rly)
or you could save up for a TII conversion and then you can say hello to efi but im pretty sure they have their own set of prblems
02-06-08, 12:58 PM
#7
Nikki-Modder Rex-Rodder
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I'll be glad to help troubleshoot your carb, but I need some info. As much as possible.
What's the problem?
What's the problem?
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02-06-08, 02:06 PM
#10
No distributor? No thanks
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Regarding the Nikki, I can tell you that understanding a carb in the first place can mean a steep learning curve but you'll be a better man for it. There's a reason that guys like women who can drive a stick, and a man just needs to understand carbs. Think of it as a badge of honor that most guys raised on EFI won't ever understand.
Once you understand how carbs work, you'll see that they all have the same fuel and air circuits, though some don't have a choke or may have different progression circuits, but it all comes out in the wash. Once you know what you've got and can understand what the fuel and air are asking of the carb as you drive, it'll grow to be very easy to troubleshoot.
For help, you can read through the center section of THIS post on vintagerotaries. There's also the page from Wikipedia HERE or How Stuff Works HERE. Take an hour to read through these and do some homework elsewhere and see if you can get the theory of operation down. It really isn't a lost cause, I can promise you.
02-06-08, 09:01 PM
#13
WHAT!!??!!?? I thought the OER was the bizzomb, Stu. Going Holley, huh?
Regarding the Nikki, I can tell you that understanding a carb in the first place can mean a steep learning curve but you'll be a better man for it. There's a reason that guys like women who can drive a stick, and a man just needs to understand carbs. Think of it as a badge of honor that most guys raised on EFI won't ever understand.
Regarding the Nikki, I can tell you that understanding a carb in the first place can mean a steep learning curve but you'll be a better man for it. There's a reason that guys like women who can drive a stick, and a man just needs to understand carbs. Think of it as a badge of honor that most guys raised on EFI won't ever understand.
After I get my foot on it (read, IDLE SUCKS HARDCORE) which is anything over 2ooo RPM, the OER is hands down the best carb I have ever ran. 4 barrels are good and all, but I am and always will be a 2 barrel guy. I don't really care much about low down drivability because... well, I drive a sports car and not a Corolla. I am learning as much as I can about carbs, I would rather run one than EFI any day.
02-07-08, 12:47 AM
#15
Great Scott!
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I run EFI and love it now... but spend the time to get to know the carb. they have a lot more character than EFI systems and I swear in a couple races my old carb would run harder in those seconds it had too...
02-07-08, 02:03 AM
#16
Rota-lution
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Ok i'll start with the history of the carb.
When i bought it, the carb was supposedly JUST REBUILT. It ran fine for a long time....a couple months or so. Then i removed my rats nest and did a crappy job rerouting my vacuum lines...i didn;t know **** about how the vacuum lines were supposed to be run. To this day i have no clue how i had it hooked up before the carb rebuild i just did.
Anyways i had lost my wingnut for the breather and was running without a cleaner for a month or so...it started having a "lumpy" idle. It would die at stops and i would have to feather the gas pedal (heel toe) whenever i stopped so it wouldn't die. I set the idle to 1250 to compensate...and it fixed my problem temporarily.
I then got another wingnut and ran the cleaner on it until i moved to Vegas. I bought a carb kist for it and just replaced all the gaskets and i found that the primary jet on the right? side was clogged with crap. I cleaned it up and cleaned the whole carb up nice and shinney and ran carb cleaner through everything. Needless to say there was not a trace of grime in it.
I took off the dashpot, adjusted floats (which i then bought new ones that were untampered with) i installed the new floats and polished the needle seats slightly and polished the float tabs to make sure it wouldn't bind.
I then put it back on my car and it would flood evertytime...i plugged in thevent solenoid and it stopped but the floats were a little high...so i tapped on it and the settled to level...one float still sits about 1mm higher than it should according to the float bowl line.
Just yesterday my car stalled in the middle of traffic and i had to ge out and look at it...it flooded horribly...the needle valves stuck open. Which i know this is common with a rebuild so i wasn't too concerned. I just deflooded and left. But it was acting wierd...bucking and shuddering...wanting to die while i drove it. It sounded like i blew a apex and i was only running one rotor. I diagnosed it and i had forgot to put on a new fuel filter so i out a new one on today. I then started my car.....it was REALLY hard to start btw...took about 5 minutes. Then i drove it around the block...it was fine for awhile but then i stopped at a stop sign and proceeded to let off the clutch and turn left...it started shuddering at 1500 RPMs and it stalled. I startted it again and it idled at 900ish...closer to 1K...it usually idles at 750...nice and smooth.
I turned it around and it died again...i turned it back on and revved it and popped the clutch...it started fine and i turned right...back onto my street...i floored it to see if i could free up any blockage in the float bowls. It had a definite loss of power at about 5000 RPM and i was scared i was going to blow a apex from leaning it out...
I got home and played witht he throttle a little...giving it a little gas at a time...it eventually died when i held it at a certian position...i looked down the carb throat and i saw fuel come out but it sounded like it was sucking WAY TOO MUCH air compared to the amount of fuel that was coming out.
Any ideas?
When i bought it, the carb was supposedly JUST REBUILT. It ran fine for a long time....a couple months or so. Then i removed my rats nest and did a crappy job rerouting my vacuum lines...i didn;t know **** about how the vacuum lines were supposed to be run. To this day i have no clue how i had it hooked up before the carb rebuild i just did.
Anyways i had lost my wingnut for the breather and was running without a cleaner for a month or so...it started having a "lumpy" idle. It would die at stops and i would have to feather the gas pedal (heel toe) whenever i stopped so it wouldn't die. I set the idle to 1250 to compensate...and it fixed my problem temporarily.
I then got another wingnut and ran the cleaner on it until i moved to Vegas. I bought a carb kist for it and just replaced all the gaskets and i found that the primary jet on the right? side was clogged with crap. I cleaned it up and cleaned the whole carb up nice and shinney and ran carb cleaner through everything. Needless to say there was not a trace of grime in it.
I took off the dashpot, adjusted floats (which i then bought new ones that were untampered with) i installed the new floats and polished the needle seats slightly and polished the float tabs to make sure it wouldn't bind.
I then put it back on my car and it would flood evertytime...i plugged in thevent solenoid and it stopped but the floats were a little high...so i tapped on it and the settled to level...one float still sits about 1mm higher than it should according to the float bowl line.
Just yesterday my car stalled in the middle of traffic and i had to ge out and look at it...it flooded horribly...the needle valves stuck open. Which i know this is common with a rebuild so i wasn't too concerned. I just deflooded and left. But it was acting wierd...bucking and shuddering...wanting to die while i drove it. It sounded like i blew a apex and i was only running one rotor. I diagnosed it and i had forgot to put on a new fuel filter so i out a new one on today. I then started my car.....it was REALLY hard to start btw...took about 5 minutes. Then i drove it around the block...it was fine for awhile but then i stopped at a stop sign and proceeded to let off the clutch and turn left...it started shuddering at 1500 RPMs and it stalled. I startted it again and it idled at 900ish...closer to 1K...it usually idles at 750...nice and smooth.
I turned it around and it died again...i turned it back on and revved it and popped the clutch...it started fine and i turned right...back onto my street...i floored it to see if i could free up any blockage in the float bowls. It had a definite loss of power at about 5000 RPM and i was scared i was going to blow a apex from leaning it out...
I got home and played witht he throttle a little...giving it a little gas at a time...it eventually died when i held it at a certian position...i looked down the carb throat and i saw fuel come out but it sounded like it was sucking WAY TOO MUCH air compared to the amount of fuel that was coming out.
Any ideas?
02-07-08, 07:35 AM
#17
Nikki-Modder Rex-Rodder
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That's a cut n' paste of the PM that you sent me that I spent 15 minutes answering.
Have you checked any of the things I suggested?
Have you checked any of the things I suggested?
02-07-08, 07:58 AM
#18
This is just a thought, but are you sure that your fuel pump is working correctly? If I were you I'd do the test that is in the Haynes manual to see if the pump is sending enough fuel up to the carb. If you are sure that you're getting enough fuel through the lines, then that will at least help you rule out the rest of the fuel system.
Jamie
Jamie
02-07-08, 08:48 AM
#19
Nikki-Modder Rex-Rodder
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This is what I told him last night, but I don't know what he found...
Re: Hey..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Experiment.Seven
What did you do about all the ports? Did you cap them all, leave any open, or actually hook nipples up to other nipples just to block them? What happened to the altitude idle compensation valve? Did you block off the ports in the airhorn where it was?
Chances are you got dust and **** inside your carburetor. At this point, you had probably plugged up one (or more) of the very tiny orifices in the idle and transition circuit bleeds. This can result in a siphoning effect at idle, especially since you've over compensated by raising the idle speed. You're now not idling on only the idle circuit, you're also idling partly on the primary main circuit.
How did you polish the needles & seats?
...And just how much air is "way too much", and just what should it sound like?
1 ) -Are your plug wires on correctly? (Go check.)
2 ) -Do you have the return line and to main fuel lines reversed on the carb? (Go check.)
3 ) -When you put the deceleration dashpot back in, did you adjust it properly? (Make sure it's not keeping the throttle from closing all the way and that the idle speed screw IS keeping it from closing all the way.)
4 ) -Does your gas cap "whoosh" when you open it? (If it does, then your tank is not venting, and the suction inside is fighting with your fuel pump.)
5 ) -Did you remove any of the fuel jets during the rebuild? (Is it possible the secondary & primary jets have been switched?)
6 ) -The venturis are the carb throats. The primaries are the small ones, and the secondaries are the large ones. Within them are the "booster" venturis. on top of each booster venturi, off to the side, under the air horn, are the emulsion tubes. These are the jets with the biggest heads on the whole carb. If any of them (the primaries in particular) are clogged, you will get a siphoning effect at anything over about 2500 RPM, and you'll flood the carb.
7 ) -Check the float bowl vent solenoid again. You can do this by turning the key to accessory, and then unhooking and rehooking the solenoid up. It should be a fairly audiable click if all else is quiet. That vent solenoid needs a positive 12V (ignition switched) to open. With no electricity present, it shuts off the vent, and the carb won't work correctly. It won't idle for ****, and it'll try to siphon while operated on the main circuit.
8 ) -The altitude idle compensation valve is what hangs off the back of the air horn. There are two white tubes coming out of it, the usual configuration being one going to a port on the throttle body, and one going to a valve on the throttle position sensor (TPS). It's fairly common to see these get ripped off with the rest of the rat's nest, and it's really not so terrible if it is. They're just put on so that the idle doesn't have to be tuned specifically for whatever altitude the brand new car ended up at. But the ports that are behind the valve run all throughout the carb and need to be blocked off like everything else. If they are not, they present themselves as a vacuum leak at idle. Most vacuum leaks associated with the emissions controls & extraneous crap really only effect idle, so even though that may be a problem you have, it's only one of them.
Right now you are idling on the main circuit, so all of your present troubles are associated with fuel delivery.
Rule out ignition first by making sure you didn't swap plugs and ****- real easy to do, and super easy to overlook. Best to check with a timing light to be sure you don't have a bum igniter. No sense in chasing the dozen carb gremlins around without checking the two or three electrical poltergeists first.
Re: Hey..
Quote:
Originally Posted by Experiment.Seven
Ok i'll start with the history of the carb.
When i bought it, the carb was supposedly JUST REBUILT. It ran fine for a long time....a couple months or so. Then i removed my rats nest and did a crappy job rerouting my vacuum lines...i didn;t know **** about how the vacuum lines were supposed to be run. To this day i have no clue how i had it hooked up before the carb rebuild i just did.
When i bought it, the carb was supposedly JUST REBUILT. It ran fine for a long time....a couple months or so. Then i removed my rats nest and did a crappy job rerouting my vacuum lines...i didn;t know **** about how the vacuum lines were supposed to be run. To this day i have no clue how i had it hooked up before the carb rebuild i just did.
Anyways i had lost my wingnut for the breather and was running without a cleaner for a month or so...it started having a "lumpy" idle. It would die at stops and i would have to feather the gas pedal (heel toe) whenever i stopped so it wouldn't die. I set the idle to 1250 to compensate...and it fixed my problem temporarily.
I then got another wingnut and ran the cleaner on it until i moved to Vegas. I bought a carb kist for it and just replaced all the gaskets and i found that the primary jet on the right? side was clogged with crap. I cleaned it up and cleaned the whole carb up nice and shinney and ran carb cleaner through everything. Needless to say there was not a trace of grime in it.
I took off the dashpot, adjusted floats (which i then bought new ones that were untampered with) i installed the new floats and polished the needle seats slightly and polished the float tabs to make sure it wouldn't bind.
I took off the dashpot, adjusted floats (which i then bought new ones that were untampered with) i installed the new floats and polished the needle seats slightly and polished the float tabs to make sure it wouldn't bind.
I then put it back on my car and it would flood evertytime...i plugged in thevent solenoid and it stopped but the floats were a little high...so i tapped on it and the settled to level...one float still sits about 1mm higher than it should according to the float bowl line.
Just yesterday my car stalled in the middle of traffic and i had to ge out and look at it...it flooded horribly...the needle valves stuck open. Which i know this is common with a rebuild so i wasn't too concerned. I just deflooded and left. But it was acting wierd...bucking and shuddering...wanting to die while i drove it. It sounded like i blew a apex and i was only running one rotor. I diagnosed it and i had forgot to put on a new fuel filter so i out a new one on today. I then started my car.....it was REALLY hard to start btw...took about 5 minutes. Then i drove it around the block...it was fine for awhile but then i stopped at a stop sign and proceeded to let off the clutch and turn left...it started shuddering at 1500 RPMs and it stalled. I startted it again and it idled at 900ish...closer to 1K...it usually idles at 750...nice and smooth.
I turned it around and it died again...i turned it back on and revved it and popped the clutch...it started fine and i turned right...back onto my street...i floored it to see if i could free up any blockage in the float bowls. It had a definite loss of power at about 5000 RPM and i was scared i was going to blow a apex from leaning it out...
I got home and played witht he throttle a little...giving it a little gas at a time...it eventually died when i held it at a certian position...i looked down the carb throat and i saw fuel come out but it sounded like it was sucking WAY TOO MUCH air compared to the amount of fuel that was coming out.
Just yesterday my car stalled in the middle of traffic and i had to ge out and look at it...it flooded horribly...the needle valves stuck open. Which i know this is common with a rebuild so i wasn't too concerned. I just deflooded and left. But it was acting wierd...bucking and shuddering...wanting to die while i drove it. It sounded like i blew a apex and i was only running one rotor. I diagnosed it and i had forgot to put on a new fuel filter so i out a new one on today. I then started my car.....it was REALLY hard to start btw...took about 5 minutes. Then i drove it around the block...it was fine for awhile but then i stopped at a stop sign and proceeded to let off the clutch and turn left...it started shuddering at 1500 RPMs and it stalled. I startted it again and it idled at 900ish...closer to 1K...it usually idles at 750...nice and smooth.
I turned it around and it died again...i turned it back on and revved it and popped the clutch...it started fine and i turned right...back onto my street...i floored it to see if i could free up any blockage in the float bowls. It had a definite loss of power at about 5000 RPM and i was scared i was going to blow a apex from leaning it out...
I got home and played witht he throttle a little...giving it a little gas at a time...it eventually died when i held it at a certian position...i looked down the carb throat and i saw fuel come out but it sounded like it was sucking WAY TOO MUCH air compared to the amount of fuel that was coming out.
Any ideas?
2 ) -Do you have the return line and to main fuel lines reversed on the carb? (Go check.)
3 ) -When you put the deceleration dashpot back in, did you adjust it properly? (Make sure it's not keeping the throttle from closing all the way and that the idle speed screw IS keeping it from closing all the way.)
4 ) -Does your gas cap "whoosh" when you open it? (If it does, then your tank is not venting, and the suction inside is fighting with your fuel pump.)
5 ) -Did you remove any of the fuel jets during the rebuild? (Is it possible the secondary & primary jets have been switched?)
6 ) -The venturis are the carb throats. The primaries are the small ones, and the secondaries are the large ones. Within them are the "booster" venturis. on top of each booster venturi, off to the side, under the air horn, are the emulsion tubes. These are the jets with the biggest heads on the whole carb. If any of them (the primaries in particular) are clogged, you will get a siphoning effect at anything over about 2500 RPM, and you'll flood the carb.
7 ) -Check the float bowl vent solenoid again. You can do this by turning the key to accessory, and then unhooking and rehooking the solenoid up. It should be a fairly audiable click if all else is quiet. That vent solenoid needs a positive 12V (ignition switched) to open. With no electricity present, it shuts off the vent, and the carb won't work correctly. It won't idle for ****, and it'll try to siphon while operated on the main circuit.
8 ) -The altitude idle compensation valve is what hangs off the back of the air horn. There are two white tubes coming out of it, the usual configuration being one going to a port on the throttle body, and one going to a valve on the throttle position sensor (TPS). It's fairly common to see these get ripped off with the rest of the rat's nest, and it's really not so terrible if it is. They're just put on so that the idle doesn't have to be tuned specifically for whatever altitude the brand new car ended up at. But the ports that are behind the valve run all throughout the carb and need to be blocked off like everything else. If they are not, they present themselves as a vacuum leak at idle. Most vacuum leaks associated with the emissions controls & extraneous crap really only effect idle, so even though that may be a problem you have, it's only one of them.
Right now you are idling on the main circuit, so all of your present troubles are associated with fuel delivery.
Rule out ignition first by making sure you didn't swap plugs and ****- real easy to do, and super easy to overlook. Best to check with a timing light to be sure you don't have a bum igniter. No sense in chasing the dozen carb gremlins around without checking the two or three electrical poltergeists first.
02-07-08, 09:11 AM
#21
Man, I missed not having you around Sterling. 
This is what the Rx7club used to be all about when I first joined. Actually trying to help people with the problems on their cars, and not giving up until its fixed. I've noticed that it has sorta shifted from that lately, but I think we can get it back on track. 
Jamie
This is what the Rx7club used to be all about when I first joined. Actually trying to help people with the problems on their cars, and not giving up until its fixed. I've noticed that it has sorta shifted from that lately, but I think we can get it back on track. Jamie
02-07-08, 09:29 AM
#22
Rota-lution
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Well i dinked with it enough and checked over everything...it's all in working order. o_O Now i will attempt the install and test. I will return with the results. No sleep all night...checking EVERYTHING on the carb.
02-07-08, 12:31 PM
#23
Rota-lution
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So it idles high...i think the stop tab on the throttle linkage is slightly bent. I will fix it when i take the carb off for the millionth time....O_O
Also....if one float is high..but the other is at the right hieght...under load would the side with the "right height" be starved of fuel due to the other bowl being filled up faster?
One of my bowls are high...the one you can see...and i am pretty sure the other bowl is even. I will adjust the almighty FLOATS when i take it off again...i know, i know...don't touch the floats but ****....they're off. O_O
And yes i will polish the tabs on the floats after i adjust them.
Also....if one float is high..but the other is at the right hieght...under load would the side with the "right height" be starved of fuel due to the other bowl being filled up faster?
One of my bowls are high...the one you can see...and i am pretty sure the other bowl is even. I will adjust the almighty FLOATS when i take it off again...i know, i know...don't touch the floats but ****....they're off. O_O
And yes i will polish the tabs on the floats after i adjust them.
Last edited by Experiment.Seven; 02-07-08 at 12:32 PM. Reason: Lack of sleep. Becoming more and more irritated.
02-07-08, 02:57 PM
#24
Nikki-Modder Rex-Rodder
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Listen, you didn't answer any of my questions. I took the time to troubleshoot the thing in a step by step process with you, and you're still tossing out random questions that demonstrate that you obviously have not even bothered to learn about how the carb works. You seem ridiculously obsessed with the ******* floats.
Did you do everything I told you?
I've put about all the effort in that I can. The next move is up to you.
YOU HAVE TO ANSWER THE GODDAMNED QUESTIONS FOR US TO HELP YOU!
Did you do everything I told you?
I've put about all the effort in that I can. The next move is up to you.
YOU HAVE TO ANSWER THE GODDAMNED QUESTIONS FOR US TO HELP YOU!
02-07-08, 03:22 PM
#25
djessence
please do what he asks of you, we dont wanna not have him around again.
(carbs is what he does...like for a business so he is your best bet for the troubshooting to answer his questions dammit!)
(carbs is what he does...like for a business so he is your best bet for the troubshooting to answer his questions dammit!)