Help! Engine died on my way to work!
01-06-16, 08:21 PM
#27
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They very well might be, however, they match the input I found for them. So, yea. I just ordered a cheap pair to see if I can get it running. I got it into my garage. If I tuned my carb with these coils, would I need to re-tune when I get "good" coils?
01-06-16, 09:24 PM
#28
84SE-EGI helpy-helperton
You're playing with coils, but your Trailing ignitor is likely the faulty part. Have you tried swapping the ignitors? Coils are further down the list of likely trouble areas. Swapping ignitors takes 10 minutes and will tell you a lot about what's wrong.
01-06-16, 09:48 PM
#29
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No, I mean, maybe, but I swapped lead and trail coils to the distributor, and then the trail plugs fired. So the ignitor has to be working correct? I mean, if I just moved coils and they all worked when working off the good coil, then the week link has to be the coil. On top of that, $32 for coils to see if that's where the problem is, is a hell of a lot cheaper than a $300 ignitor...
01-07-16, 12:40 AM
#30
84SE-EGI helpy-helperton
J-109 ignitors are more 'pick-a-part' pieces than paying stealership pricing. I carry a spare ignitor in the glove box, because I've had them go out and they don't last forever. The coils on the other hand, have been good for 30+ years.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
01-07-16, 06:23 AM
#31
carb whisperer
J-109 ignitors are more 'pick-a-part' pieces than paying stealership pricing. I carry a spare ignitor in the glove box, because I've had them go out and they don't last forever. The coils on the other hand, have been good for 30+ years.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
01-07-16, 06:56 AM
#32
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J-109 ignitors are more 'pick-a-part' pieces than paying stealership pricing. I carry a spare ignitor in the glove box, because I've had them go out and they don't last forever. The coils on the other hand, have been good for 30+ years.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
My point being that the ignitor is far more likely to be the cause. I'm confused by your description that you changed the coils - if your ignitor isn't working, the coil energy will not be directed to a spark plug - leading or trailing. If your tach isn't working - then your trailing ignition isn't working, i.e., the coil isn't firing - because that's how the tach gets it's signal. The coil not firing leads me back to the ignitor.
01-10-16, 08:46 PM
#36
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It hit me in the shower. So, driving, trailing coil dies, rpm tach goes to nothing and loses power, killing power to my fuel pump, starving out my engine. Would that be a reasonable theory?
01-11-16, 12:27 AM
#37
84SE-EGI helpy-helperton
Fuel pump circuit is independent of trailing coil or tach operation. I see you keep going back to your coils being the problem - but they're more than likely not it. Have you swapped your ignitors and put your ignition wiring back the way it should be? If not, that's your next step.
01-11-16, 06:12 AM
#38
carb whisperer
Fuel pump circuit is independent of trailing coil or tach operation. I see you keep going back to your coils being the problem - but they're more than likely not it. Have you swapped your ignitors and put your ignition wiring back the way it should be? If not, that's your next step.
Actually, on 12A cars, the fuel pump relay is NOT engaged if there is no trailing coil firing. The fuel pump will not work.
Its common to unhook the trailing lead when deflooding a carb to shut the pump off.
Could be the issue indeed.
01-11-16, 07:41 AM
#40
carb whisperer
01-11-16, 07:58 AM
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It is a 12a FB, and the fuel pump, from my understanding is powered by the trailing coil. Erick31876 helped me bypass that yesterday. My coils come in today, so we'll see how this goes. I could have tried to start it with just the leading coils, but, that's no fun! @longduck, it's not the ignitors. When I connect the trail or lead feed to the dizzy, to the good, working coil, whichever one is connected fires. So if the trail igniter was bad, I wouldn't get spark from the plugs correct? But if I get spark from all 4, solely dependent on whichever is connect to the good coil, then my igniters HAVE to be good.
01-11-16, 09:50 PM
#42
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kaboom! she works again! she has life! I started messing around with the carb a little bit, and finally have it idling properly. It'll definitely take more time to get the rest of it set up properly though. I haven't seen much as far as rats nest removal. I know I have a lot of open connectors in my engine bay, can I trace those back to wherever they go and just cut them off? I mean, they aren't connected to anything now, so it's not like the ECU is being tricked into thinking everything is working properly. Also, there are no emissions where I'm at, so I don't really care about them.
01-12-16, 07:59 AM
#43
Waffles - hmmm good
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If you cut the wires, make sure you know what they were for, otherwise you will sorely miss
them when one is needed on the off chance that it was disconnected in error. Read up on the
wiring diagrams.
The ECU doesn't do much. Its not in direct control of the timing or firing of the plugs like a
modern ECU. Mostly it will shutdown trailing ignition or toggle some switch in the rats nest to
get the carb to do emissions friendly things like lean or richen the mixture.
them when one is needed on the off chance that it was disconnected in error. Read up on the
wiring diagrams.
The ECU doesn't do much. Its not in direct control of the timing or firing of the plugs like a
modern ECU. Mostly it will shutdown trailing ignition or toggle some switch in the rats nest to
get the carb to do emissions friendly things like lean or richen the mixture.
01-12-16, 06:31 PM
#44
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I would do it while the engine is running, hoping that if I cut the wrong one on accident, it will be blatantly apparent, (hoping).
I have it running again, and took it for a few spins around the neighborhood tonight, and it became apparent that while cruising, the car "surges." By that I mean that I was cruising around doing about 30mph in 3rd gear, and it would be alright, but then it would "surge," almost as though the carburetor is not letting enough fuel through, and then all of a sudden the fuel goes to the engine. Anyone else ever deal with a Weber Carb? It's a 45DCOE. Not sure of the jet, they were installed already. When I bought the car, it had this thing on it, but definitely needed help. I went ahead last night and readjusted the idle mixture screws. They were almost the whole way out. Maybe a turn or turn and a half is all that was holding them in.
Also, anyone know where I can get the side markers at? I need lenses, but also the housings for them. I just have a hole there now. If not, would it look tacky if I put 3 led light strip there in it's place?
I have it running again, and took it for a few spins around the neighborhood tonight, and it became apparent that while cruising, the car "surges." By that I mean that I was cruising around doing about 30mph in 3rd gear, and it would be alright, but then it would "surge," almost as though the carburetor is not letting enough fuel through, and then all of a sudden the fuel goes to the engine. Anyone else ever deal with a Weber Carb? It's a 45DCOE. Not sure of the jet, they were installed already. When I bought the car, it had this thing on it, but definitely needed help. I went ahead last night and readjusted the idle mixture screws. They were almost the whole way out. Maybe a turn or turn and a half is all that was holding them in.
Also, anyone know where I can get the side markers at? I need lenses, but also the housings for them. I just have a hole there now. If not, would it look tacky if I put 3 led light strip there in it's place?
01-13-16, 10:14 AM
#46
Waffles - hmmm good
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I would do it while the engine is running, hoping that if I cut the wrong one on accident, it will be blatantly apparent, (hoping).
I have it running again, and took it for a few spins around the neighborhood tonight, and it became apparent that while cruising, the car "surges." By that I mean that I was cruising around doing about 30mph in 3rd gear, and it would be alright, but then it would "surge," almost as though the carburetor is not letting enough fuel through, and then all of a sudden the fuel goes to the engine. Anyone else ever deal with a Weber Carb? It's a 45DCOE. Not sure of the jet, they were installed already. When I bought the car, it had this thing on it, but definitely needed help. I went ahead last night and readjusted the idle mixture screws. They were almost the whole way out. Maybe a turn or turn and a half is all that was holding them in.
Also, anyone know where I can get the side markers at? I need lenses, but also the housings for them. I just have a hole there now. If not, would it look tacky if I put 3 led light strip there in it's place?
I have it running again, and took it for a few spins around the neighborhood tonight, and it became apparent that while cruising, the car "surges." By that I mean that I was cruising around doing about 30mph in 3rd gear, and it would be alright, but then it would "surge," almost as though the carburetor is not letting enough fuel through, and then all of a sudden the fuel goes to the engine. Anyone else ever deal with a Weber Carb? It's a 45DCOE. Not sure of the jet, they were installed already. When I bought the car, it had this thing on it, but definitely needed help. I went ahead last night and readjusted the idle mixture screws. They were almost the whole way out. Maybe a turn or turn and a half is all that was holding them in.
Also, anyone know where I can get the side markers at? I need lenses, but also the housings for them. I just have a hole there now. If not, would it look tacky if I put 3 led light strip there in it's place?
elect diagrams and make decisions on what stays and what goes. Also if you cut
them out, tape em up to make sure they don't short out.
You may have a weak fuel pump or a clog in the system. Does it have the stock
pump or aftermarket? Does it have a FPR to regulate the pressure and flow?
01-13-16, 01:05 PM
#47
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I do have the electric diagrams, I'll definitely look at them before I cut anything. And, I always tape everything up.
I'm not sure on the fuel pump. I know that there is a Jegs regulator and gauge. When it idles in the garage at first, I get about 3.5psi, but I noticed that after I went and drove it last night, I let it idle in the garage, and I was getting maybe .5 psi.... Not sure if the sensor is bad, or if I just wasn't getting fuel pressure. I knew the pump was still running though.
I'm not sure on the fuel pump. I know that there is a Jegs regulator and gauge. When it idles in the garage at first, I get about 3.5psi, but I noticed that after I went and drove it last night, I let it idle in the garage, and I was getting maybe .5 psi.... Not sure if the sensor is bad, or if I just wasn't getting fuel pressure. I knew the pump was still running though.
01-13-16, 02:29 PM
#48
Waffles - hmmm good
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If the gauge is a 0-15 one, it will probably ready correctly cold but be out of spec when it gets
hot under the hood. Mine does the same thing. 3.5 psi is about right for that carb but it may
want more. I suspect thats the stock fuel pump but you should check. The stocker may not
be able to feed that carb or it might just be weak. Also the filter may be clogging up as well.
All the manuals, including elect diagrams, can be had on line at Foxed.ca
hot under the hood. Mine does the same thing. 3.5 psi is about right for that carb but it may
want more. I suspect thats the stock fuel pump but you should check. The stocker may not
be able to feed that carb or it might just be weak. Also the filter may be clogging up as well.
All the manuals, including elect diagrams, can be had on line at Foxed.ca
01-13-16, 03:31 PM
#49
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The gauge is a 0-15, I was looking at getting a new filter. A $6 filter is a cheap, and quick replacement. I was going to pull the tank and clean it out anyways. So I'll check the pump then.
As far as the diagrams go, I used my work printer and printed out every single thing I could find on the 83-85 cars. Thanks for the help! Is there a specific pump you would use? Hopefully in or around the $80-120 range?
As far as the diagrams go, I used my work printer and printed out every single thing I could find on the 83-85 cars. Thanks for the help! Is there a specific pump you would use? Hopefully in or around the $80-120 range?
01-13-16, 03:45 PM
#50
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Actually, as I recall, I think there is a Jegs fuel pump, not in the tank, it's an inline one. I'll take a picture and post it in a couple of minutes to see what you guys think.