GSL + FC 6-port = ???
07-06-05, 10:42 PM
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GSL + FC 6-port = ???
Forgive my asking a weird question, but in Australia we got different spec cars to the US and we never got the GSL-SE or the RE-EGI engine.
Our 84-85 cars have a carb'd 12a but GSL-SE everything else (as far as I know). How close to a GSL-SE would an Aussie-spec 84/85 be with a NA 6-port from an FC?
Our 84-85 cars have a carb'd 12a but GSL-SE everything else (as far as I know). How close to a GSL-SE would an Aussie-spec 84/85 be with a NA 6-port from an FC?
07-06-05, 11:40 PM
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1st gen vs. 2nd gen motors
When they decided to make the GSL-SE, Mazda, being always very conservative, beefed up just about everything, including the axles. Rather than make two different parts for everything, they made all 1984 and 85 RX-7s with the heavier front and rear axles (larger diameter). The interiors of the GSL models in the US are indistinguishable from the GSL-SE as far as I know, I have had both. The SE fuel tank had the higher pressure pump, and of course the wiring was quite different with the fuel injection of the SE. Both the GSL and GSL-SE had the limited slip, and I assume the gear ratio was the same, not quite sure about that. I believe the GSL-SE used different brake pads, so presumably the calipers were different, not sure about the discs. The SE also had 14 inch wheels with a different bolt pattern, 4 bolts on a 4 1/2 inch circle, which is very common to many Ford, Chrysler, Toyota and others. Only God and a few retired people in Hiroshima know why.
Not visible from the outside is that the rotary engines through 1985 had the seal grooves in the aluminum rotor housings, and the cast iron surfaces were flat. Starting in 1986, the seal grooves are in the cast iron housings. Internally the early engines had the 3 mm apex seals, which were very durable. The 86 and later engines used 2 mm apex seals, which are more fragile. The SE had two fuel injectors, whereas the 86 and later engines had 4 injectors, at least here in the US.
The earlier engines had the mounts on the front cover. Starting with the 2nd gen cars in 1986, the motor mounts are in the center of the engine. This was due to the crossmember location , so the oil pan is also different, and you would have to change that also to install the late engine. People have certainly done it, but all things considered, it is not a simple swap. Somewhere on this forum may be a listing of all the required changes.
It may be easier to install a V-8! That is what I did.
www.cardomain.com/ride/646433
Not visible from the outside is that the rotary engines through 1985 had the seal grooves in the aluminum rotor housings, and the cast iron surfaces were flat. Starting in 1986, the seal grooves are in the cast iron housings. Internally the early engines had the 3 mm apex seals, which were very durable. The 86 and later engines used 2 mm apex seals, which are more fragile. The SE had two fuel injectors, whereas the 86 and later engines had 4 injectors, at least here in the US.
The earlier engines had the mounts on the front cover. Starting with the 2nd gen cars in 1986, the motor mounts are in the center of the engine. This was due to the crossmember location , so the oil pan is also different, and you would have to change that also to install the late engine. People have certainly done it, but all things considered, it is not a simple swap. Somewhere on this forum may be a listing of all the required changes.
It may be easier to install a V-8! That is what I did.
www.cardomain.com/ride/646433
Last edited by stilettoman; 07-06-05 at 11:42 PM.
07-07-05, 12:04 AM
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In Australia rotary workshops are present in every big city - it's easier to put the front cover from a 12a on to a 13b than to swap a V8 in -- a conversion that is almost unheard of here. 13b and 13bT swaps into 1st gens are very common here and most, if not all, use a front-cover from a 12a to get the mounting.
07-07-05, 02:01 AM
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I have a 6-port 13B in my 82 SA with the 12A front cover (12A turbo coveR? - not sure exactly) so it bolts right up to stock mounts. Still using a stock s2 gearbox and open diff. (Killed one gearbox already).
07-07-05, 02:07 AM
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easier to just put a FB 13b in, i did it, dont need to change the oil pan or anything really. the motor mounts have to be beaten to submission to line up the gear box, otherwise its pretty straight-forward.
the FB 13b's have just as good potential as the FC engines aswell, minus the turbo variants.
plus having the 13b in a 12a car is a difference of about 300lbs from the GSL-SE, more HP, less weight = more fun. i couldnt get the EFI on my car to work due to the lack of a proper front harness. i eventually just went to a Holley setup and the car runs decent now (im still tuning it tho) the EFI system im sure would be better for gas mileage a0cnd driveability but the Holley 600 should be a blast with the added power.
V8 swaps are fairly simple, if you are good at monkey wrenching and familiar with these cars. then again carb is going to be the easiest way to swap. but your weight balance wont be as good.
g'luck on whatever you're planning on doing!
the FB 13b's have just as good potential as the FC engines aswell, minus the turbo variants.
plus having the 13b in a 12a car is a difference of about 300lbs from the GSL-SE, more HP, less weight = more fun. i couldnt get the EFI on my car to work due to the lack of a proper front harness. i eventually just went to a Holley setup and the car runs decent now (im still tuning it tho) the EFI system im sure would be better for gas mileage a0cnd driveability but the Holley 600 should be a blast with the added power.
V8 swaps are fairly simple, if you are good at monkey wrenching and familiar with these cars. then again carb is going to be the easiest way to swap. but your weight balance wont be as good.
g'luck on whatever you're planning on doing!
07-07-05, 06:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Paradox
easier to just put a FB 13b in
the EFI system im sure would be better for gas mileage a0cnd driveability but the Holley 600 should be a blast with the added power.
Webers are the preferred carb to swap on to a rotor in Oz. I have a mate who has a 13b 6-port with bridged secondaries running a weber. It makes really good power.
V8 swaps are fairly simple, if you are good at monkey wrenching and familiar with these cars. then again carb is going to be the easiest way to swap. but your weight balance wont be as good.
g'luck on whatever you're planning on doing!
On the whole, I really want a GSL-SE but seeing as we never got a propper GSL-SE I'm just wondering out loud about how close I could get with the spec of cars that we got delivered here.
