T_Racer

iTrader: (1)

So first off I have searched, and read the manufacturer's sites, other forums, etc. But here is where I am trying to narrow the search down and start getting some parts lists going.

I have a 1983 GSL, which is undergoing cancer treatment right now. It is currently the beautiful factory doo-doo brown. I am going for a full color change to light charcoal/dark silver. But in the midst, figured to remove the whole interior and fix rust, dye the interior, blah blah blah. Basically take a driving car and turn it into a jackstand queen.
The engine as well is getting redone. I have obtained an S5 that should be in good shape. Will be going with a large Streetport from rotary shack, bdc, pineapple, will see. The engine will stay NA at this point, looking for about 175-200hp. For EMS part, I am looking at a TWM, or something simialar, Weber/Dell style throttle body, and either stick with dizzy for now, or run a CAS from the engine.
Now, for the EMS part. I am thinking into the future, but want to get my feet wet. I have looked at the microtech, haltech, Elelctromotive as my main three choices. Don't know why, just like them. The features seem to be there, and good support for all of them from tuners.
I will eventually go to TII so upgradeability is important to me. In the sense, I could save the expense later if I already have a capable EMS. So while I think, for example, the Microtech LT10 is a bit overkill for a streetport NA motor, would handle the needs later of a TII application.
What I am looking for is any suggestions for brands, models, things to look for in general, etc. I know there will be a lot of opinions, looking for educated opinions, real world experience, insight I may be overlooking, etc. I learning as much as I can, have a good deal of knowledge now, but would like to do this a lot myself, to educate and for me and the car to evolve.
I know this sounds like a ramble, but if any clarification is needed, please ask and I will help in any way for the help I recieve.

Cheers,
Travis Nelson

T_Racer

iTrader: (1)

I know this seems vague, if I am not being clear as to what I am asking, please ask me and I will help you help me.

Travis

elwood

iTrader: (1)

I'm using a MoTeC M2R.

Advantages: MoTeC reliability, known by many tuners, accepts virtually any sensors (including Mazda Crank Angle Sensors), can run any ignition setup (3 coils or 4 coils), can manage a boost control solenoid, can be resold for good $$, outstanding tech support through experts in NC, AZ, and CA (different time zones can help a lot when you're working on the car at night)

Disadvantages: Pricey.

If I had more time and less money, I'd try Megasquirt. They're very cheap, and the capabilities are expanding. There's a whole section of the forum dedicated to them. You can buy them ready-made for a fraction of the cost of other ECUs.

trochoid

iTrader: (6)

First and best advice is if you are not doing the tuning yourself, buy the unit that your tuner is most familiar with and recommends. If you're doing your own tuning, MegaSquirt is a very good choice if you feel comfortable with it. For the price on an MS unit, you can buy a good used laptop to go with it and still spend less than the base unit of any of the others.

Even though my TII upgrade keeps getting pushed back, I will go with the MS unit when it eventually happens. Electronics and tuning with a standalone are totally new territory for me but I'm willing to dive in head first and learn. Support for The MS unit is growing here on the forum and much more is available on the big MS forum.

Motec is the Cadillac of standalones, and the price reflects that. It's used by many of the big race teams and is a serious unit. Other than price, another big disadvantage for me is it needs to be shipped back to Australia if the unit needs service. The MS is more like a Pinto on steroids and a good choice for the budget minded DIYer.

rolfs_7

I agree with Trochoid. I just got my MS kit yesterday, I bought the unassembled kit and had it together in 2-3 hours and powered it up. I will be putting it in this weekend along with a carputer to tune it. I have known many people who have bought MS and love it. I think one of the best parts is if anything happens with the circuitry like burnt up diode or resistor you can go to radio shack get the part for a buck or two and put it in instead of sending it off for a month.

XLR8

iTrader: (52)

If you are getting a complete S5 engine I would not mess with the TWM intake. It may flow more but the benefits are minimal considering the cost. The S5 intake and injectors will work fine and will save you some time and sensor cost, as some ECU's retrofit to the existing sensors.

For a Stand Alone ECU you want to purchase wisely. As you said, you need an ECU that will be adiquate to handle a TII setup later so you will need that flexability. You also will want to get something that your tuner has experience with.

You can tune yourself with a wideband. The cost is about the same and the learning curve is much longer. Since it's an NA, detonation is much less likely so you can afford to make some mistakes. Ultimately it would be much simpler to pay the 3-400 to have it tuned and be done with it, then pay the 3-400 for a wideband and countless hours figuring out how things work.

The words "Stand Alone ECU" and "cheap" really don't go together. You will always sacrifice quality and capability by going with something cheaper. There are many fuel only ECU's like a Haltech F10 that work great. They would not be the best for a turbo application but they can work well.

I personally prefer a Haltech E6X and that is what I would recommend.

Blake

Abso-freakin'-lootly! Even if you are tuning yourself, find out which systems are most popular locally with both tuners and end-users. The "hot setup" will vary town-to-town, state-to-state, region-to-region. Even if it is techically inferior in some manner, the fact that there are local people who have gotten it to work reliably far outweighs anything else because they can help you avoid pitfalls, troubleshoot problems, loan you sensors, share maps and even plug their box into your harness to see if the problem is with the ECU or some other part of the system.

That said, of the consumer systems, we like the Apex'i PowerFC (S5/6 only) and Electromotive's TECIII (universal) the most. These are head-and-shoulders above the second-tier systems, like Haltech, Microtech and so forth, and only slightly less capable than the big-buck MoTeCs. Haltech and Microtech systems can be made to work well, but there always seem to be little tuning glitches that are hard or impossible to iron out and aspect of the tuning software or reliability of the flash memory to deal with. At least that has been our experience. I do, however, appreciate the ease of installation of the Microtech LT-series. Very well documented and clearly labeled harness. But if your tuner knows and likes Haltech, for example, by all means get a Haltech! No need to pave new trails to the same destination.

T_Racer

iTrader: (1)

Thanks one and all for the answers. I also like the MS for the price and DIY part about it. One thing, this may or may not matter.
I got the engine only, no ecu, no UIM, TB, etc. So I will get it running with the Dell as I build up the FI system.
But I mention this as I will not be using a lot of the factory efi parts. TPS, AIS, etc. So I can use what sensors I prefer, be it factory or aftermarket from the EMS company that I use. If it is easier to reuse the mazda water temp, this and that, then I will do that. But for example, I can use the TPS for the TWM throttle bodies on any ems, any wideband O2, etc.
I just need to do more research and see. If anyone has any additional info or tips, please I am welcome to all suggestions.

Cheers,
Travis Nelson

Breadfan

Im currently running a microtech fuel only w/ 12AT dist, problem being no one in the area likes tuning it. I've made good numbers w/ it on a stock S5.

I have friends with megasquirt that cant find anyone able to tune it, and having problems with the ecm software.

Most the tuners around this area really like the haltech software, and are getting good results. If you have the money by all means buy a motec imo best ecm's on the market.